Di Canio is a twat

[Rob]

And furthermore, every American and Brit reading this should be disgusted that Di Canio and others in Italy are spitting on the sacrifices we made so Italians would be rid of Mussolini and facism.

Oh, I thought it was for rights like freedom of speech where people would be free to portray their political ideologies in a manner that is non-violent and doesn’t physically hurt others, through speeches and public gatherings and writings.

Silly me.

 

[pefan]

Whilst fascism is distasteful to many of us, the fact remains he is entitled to his view. We seem to live in a world where the only acceptable viewpoints are those that are acceptable to the politically correct, left wing brigade, who seem to think they are in charge. Whilst Im no fascist, Im getting rather sick and tired of an unelected, unrepresentative collection of "thought-police" a la 1984, trying to dictate to everyone else what they can say, what they can believe in and what they can think. Many of the same people who would prevent the likes of Di Canio airing his beliefs are quite happy to allow the oxygen of publicity for the likes of Osama Bin Laden et al, because that happens to suit their, anti-American, anti-British political mindset.

Your wrong he should be hung and shot in the forehead for being a fascist!!! No to any form of Racism or Fascism. Dont accept it!!! He is entitled to his opinion but should keep his stupid opinions to himself. Because they are not acceptable in modern day society. Why would anyone side with Di Canio?????

 

[pefan]

I dont think there are that many people on here that would want to restict Di Canios freedom of thought.On the contrary,thats one of the precious luxuries that we in the "free" world have .Let him and other sicko's think what they like,let then speak to each other and share their perverted views between themselves.Personally,i dont wanna hear his thoughts.I do not wish to know about his facist leanings and i certainly dont want to switch on my TV to watch a football match, and see that prick giving his Nazi friends a facist salute.Football is not a platform for politics.Football takes me away from those realities for a while and i do not want to witness crap like that.
The guys i meet up with at Chelsea all have various political leanings.We never discuss politics because what we all have in common,is Football.If we entered into a political discussion we would probably end up fighting about it.Politics is that emotive .So,i'm glad actually that DiCanio did that because,not only did it wake us up to the man he is but,sent a reminder around the world that Facism is still alive and kicking within Europe and maybe we have allowed complacency to set in,ignoring some serious realities.
Someone said it was no big deal what DiCanio did.On the contrary i think it has actually turned into a very big deal.We now have the Italian Government defending DiCanio's actions and actually playing down the Evils of Facism.Add to that Fifa and Uefa.They are getting heavily involved too,as they should.
It will be interesting to see if Silvio Burlusconi gets re-elected in Italy's forthcoming elections after he has given the world his point of view.This will run and run i think.

Go pede....Why cant people be like this guy. Not siding at all with any form of bigotry and discrimination. Because this attitude reflects modern day society and is the only way forward. Why are some people saying "but blah blah" Not buts its no acceptable at all!!! IF the government in italia can defend that. I have to say it is a sad shame! These are the same people that will do right by there people and rescue there hostages in Iraq. But on the other hand will defend Fascism. amazing!

 

[Viking141]

Go pede....Why cant people be like this guy. Not siding at all with any form of bigotry and discrimination. Because this attitude reflects modern day society and is the only way forward. Why are some people saying "but blah blah" Not buts its no acceptable at all!!! IF the government in italia can defend that. I have to say it is a sad shame! These are the same people that will do right by there people and rescue there hostages in Iraq. But on the other hand will defend Fascism. amazing!

But who set pede up as the guardian of "modern day society?" Who says his views reflects "modern day society?" Just because pede says this that and the next doesnt make it so. Think for yourselves people! If I dont want to hear Di Canios views I just ignore them, but, and this is the important bit, that is MY choice. It is not and should not be up to some unelected, self-appointed moral guardian to decide for me what I should and should not hear or see or do. The trouble is there are quite a few self-righteous so-and so's around these days who seem to think that I and everyone else, should conform to some supposed "conventional wisdom" that says "x" is right and "y" is completely wrong and no-one in their right mind should believe in it. The only person who is fit to make that choice for me is ME not pede and not anyone else. If Di Canio wants to believe in that fascist crap then let him. Let him make a complete fool of himself. But dont try and shove your moralising fingers in my ears when Im quite intelligent enough to make up my mind for myself. I will not be dictated to by anyone, what is politically fit or unfit for my consumption - ints nobody elses decision but my own and that right, that freedom to choose should apply to us all - dont listen to the unelected, "pc" thought-fascists who are trying to dictate to you, that puts them in the same ball-park as Di Canio and his fascist buddies.

 

[pede54]

You are showing a little paranoia and being rather condescending towards these people here i think.Please acknowledge that people on these forums have their points of view and you have yours.They also have the intelligence to express those views too,without being "brainwashed" by somebody else beforehand.
Also they are probably most aware of how society will endeavour to turn their thoughts and opinions in a particular direction.We are as aware of these things as you are.

Dont get me wrong,i agree that the only person who should decide for you,is you.In the same regard ,the only person who decides what i do or do not see,hear or feel, is ME.
I decide that i do not wish to be privy to the fact, that DiCanio is a Facist,but HE has decided that i WILL be aware of him and his perverted politics.Has he the right to do that?
What do i do?
Do i never watch another football match that involves Lazio?.....Where is my freedom of choice in that?

Personally i too would like to see every last Facist on the planet exterminated but,as frustrating and difficult as it is,i believe that every person is entitled to his or her opinions and politics.Whether i find them distasteful or not.Let anybody attend meetings,rallies and elections to debate or dictate their views.That is part of being free.
This is not about personal freedoms.This is simply about having someones views and politics shoved down my throat,without giving ME the choice over whether i want to hear them or not.
Actually thats exactly what you were saying i believe The choice should be MINE.

 

[Viking141]

You are showing a little paranoia and being rather condescending towards these people here i think.Please acknowledge that people on these forums have their points of view and you have yours.They also have the intelligence to express those views too,without being "brainwashed" by somebody else beforehand.
Also they are probably most aware of how society will endeavour to turn their thoughts and opinions in a particular direction.We are as aware of these things as you are.

Dont get me wrong,i agree that the only person who should decide for you,is you.In the same regard ,the only person who decides what i do or do not see,hear or feel, is ME.
I decide that i do not wish to be privy to the fact, that DiCanio is a Facist,but HE has decided that i WILL be aware of him and his perverted politics.Has he the right to do that?
What do i do?
Do i never watch another football match that involves Lazio?.....Where is my freedom of choice in that?

Personally i too would like to see every last Facist on the planet exterminated but,as frustrating and difficult as it is,i believe that every person is entitled to his or her opinions and politics.Whether i find them distasteful or not.Let anybody attend meetings,rallies and elections to debate or dictate their views.That is part of being free.
This is not about personal freedoms.This is simply about having someones views and politics shoved down my throat,without giving ME the choice over whether i want to hear them or not.
Actually thats exactly what you were saying i believe The choice should be MINE.

What disturbs me most is the lack of democratic sentiment being expressed on this board. There are those on here who would deny Di Canio his right to express himself freely and therefore they are not true democrats. Any democracy must adhere to certain tenets - freedom of speech, freedom of expression and freedom of political association being three of them and yet there are those on here who would deny that freedom to Di Canio! These freedoms MUST apply to everybody, not just to those whose opinionsand beliefs happen to agree with yours, otherwise we do not have true freedom. Was it not one of the French philosophers, Sartre I think, who said "I disagree entirely with what you have said, but I would fight to the death for your right to say it." This belief is fundamental if you truly believe in a democratic society. Yes I agree Di Canios views are distasteful, as are those of the Imams, who at Friday prayers up and down the UK spread their message of hate, but, in any truly free society they must have the right to say what they like without hindrance. That way, their poisened views can be aired in the light of day and give us all the opportunity to scrutinise them and challenge them openly, for that is the only way they will truly be defeated. By banning this and disallowing that all you do is drive it underground and add to an already well developed persecution complex which only serves to recruit new recruits to whatever cause that may be. Di Canio has every right to make you aware that he is a fascist. Your right is not to listen to him whilst at the same time remembering that there are other people who might want to. Instead perhaps, we should try dealing with those who would find such a message appealing and try tackling what makes them find that message attractive in the first place.

 

[pefan]

why would you allow somebody to express bigotry and stupidity in the eye of the public???? By doing so you are showing you are backwards like the rest of europe!! In mordern day society i was talking about a place like England for instance. Because place in i've been to in Europe still show that they have no moved forward.

Everyone has their right but someone like Di Canio who is expressing himself in that manner when he knows what it means to people is very stupid. Or lets agree with you eh. He should be allowed to indirectly say what Mussolini and Hitler where preaching. Its his beliefs so that all good. Amazing!

 

[Viking141]

why would you allow somebody to express bigotry and stupidity in the eye of the public???? By doing so you are showing you are backwards like the rest of europe!! In mordern day society i was talking about a place like England for instance. Because place in i've been to in Europe still show that they have no moved forward.

Everyone has their right but someone like Di Canio who is expressing himself in that manner when he knows what it means to people is very stupid. Or lets agree with you eh. He should be allowed to indirectly say what Mussolini and Hitler where preaching. Its his beliefs so that all good. Amazing!

You cannot have "selective" democracy. Either the rights and freedoms bestowed by true democracy apply to EVERYONE EQUALLY or not at all. No matter how distasteful someones views are, if you ban them from speaking them or expressing them in public you then become what you say you despise - a dictator. You are dictating to people what is and what is not an acceptable political belief system - precisely the kind of beliefs that Nazis/fascists subscribe to. You descend to their level and become like them in denying the freedoms that they would deny to you.

 

[Andrejs]

Oh god I can't believe you, Viking. What if every player would start showing off their beliefs on the footy field? Commies, anarchists, nudists etc. etc. Be what you want off the field but come on, leave the politics out of the football grounds.

 

[Viking141]

Oh god I can't believe you, Viking. What if every player would start showing off their beliefs on the footy field? Commies, anarchists, nudists etc. etc. Be what you want off the field but come on, leave the politics out of the football grounds.

I agree that there is a time and a place for things and perhaps the football field is not it - perhaps I didnt make that clear. But people on here have been suggesting that Di Canio should be banned from having his beliefs carte blanche! One even suggested he should be "hung and shot in the head" for his beliefs for gods sake!!

There can be nothing more offensive than suggesting someone should be executed for their beliefs - since this suggestion is hugely offensive should the perpetrator be banned or is he entitled to have his say like everyone else? Personally, whilst I find the thoughts expressed offensive, I still believe that he is entitled to his opinion and to air that opinion freely, without threat of severe retribution, otherwise all is lost. Just remember that what is considered "acceptable" to you now may not be considered so in the future by others - does that mean that you should be banned for having them, just because you dont subscribe to whatever school of thought is "soup of the day?" Dont think so.

 

[yim87]

switzerland had god knows how many years of peace. "free" as you lot say. free of political ideologies, free of hitler. and what have they contributed to the world today?


the cuckoo clock.


di canio was in the wrong yes. but calling for him to be shot is just

yeah raising your hand in a football stadium is much more serious than kidnapping!

 

[pefan]

You cannot have "selective" democracy. Either the rights and freedoms bestowed by true democracy apply to EVERYONE EQUALLY or not at all. No matter how distasteful someones views are, if you ban them from speaking them or expressing them in public you then become what you say you despise - a dictator. You are dictating to people what is and what is not an acceptable political belief system - precisely the kind of beliefs that Nazis/fascists subscribe to. You descend to their level and become like them in denying the freedoms that they would deny to you.

Thank god i live in London!!! Phew cuz i'm confident that if someone openly said or preached that cr*p the police will have something to say about it. So hardly anyone does it cause they know its wrong. Thank goodness for that. Meanwhile the rest of europe can promote there so called free speech. I dont want to see or know about it!!! And i probably wont as long as i'm careful what i watch on t.v or who i hang around with! End of story!!

 

[Viking141]

Thank god i live in London!!! Phew cuz i'm confident that if someone openly said or preached that cr*p the police will have something to say about it. So hardly anyone does it cause they know its wrong. Thank goodness for that. Meanwhile the rest of europe can promote there so called free speech. I dont want to see or know about it!!! And i probably wont as long as i'm careful what i watch on t.v or who i hang around with! End of story!!

You make my point for me. The fact that you feel you have to be "careful what I watch on tv or who I hang around with" is scary! In a free society you shouldn't have to feel this way and just goes to show how far this current govts control freakery has gone in undermining all of our basic rights and freedoms. The founding fathers in America said that if their rights under the constitution were ever constrained or lost it would be under the disguise of a threat from a foreign enemy. Whilst we dont have a written constitution in this country the threat to our freedoms is the same - it comes from within rather than without.

 

[pede54]

sorry mate.....you might like to think you are on top of everything with your theories about thought control but what you have done is exactly what you say will befall the rest of us.You are hooked on "the soup of the day" and your arguments are just fine for Nirvana,but this is reality.

First off you say that everyone is entitled to air their opinions,and entitled to make us listen to those opinions.Then you say that the football field is perhaps not the place to do it.Then someone says "Well,OK i will not watch the TV then ,in fear of seeing this particular person demonstrating his freedoms."
Then you tell this guy that it is"scary" if he has to stop watching TV because he does not want to see this particular person expressing his beliefs.

So what is it going to be.....
1.....Allow political expression at football games,which means some people will then be restricted in their veiwing?This gives the first person his/her rights,but the second persons rights are then infringed.........or......
2.....Ban all political expression at football matches,which in turn will allow any individual to watch a game of football without having their sensitivities or choice compromised.

Both statements contradict each other but those are the only 2 choices that there are in this case.So which one is it to be? You need to choose one of them.
But by using your theory of "freedom for all",one party will have his rights compromised.So how do you prevent that happening?

This is a thread about whether political expression(left wing,right wing or any other wing)has its place in a football stadium on match day.This is not about universal human rights.You must live in a bubble if you think that humanity will sit back and allow Facism to get a hold on the World again.Facists ARE entitled to their views and they are entitled to talk,write and express those views(no matter how distasteful).They do not have the right to FORCE me to listen.I have rights too.
If you know anything about history at all,you will know that Facism was once given the freedom to exist.So then we had Facist Governments gaining power within a country by whatever means.Then these Facists give us Genocide,torture,murder,discrimination,Xenophobia intolerance and repression.
Never again will Facism ever enjoy the full meaning of freedom.That was the price that that particular idealology paid for abusing humanity.They caused Millions of people to suffer,and it took more millions of lives to erase the stink of their existence,when they drew in the rest of the World against them.
You get a chance,and when you blow it big time.....Thats it.You forfeit the right to your rights.That is the penalty to be paid.
History teaches us that we must learn from mistakes,and act swiftly when extremism threatens our freedoms.That includes ALL extremism.left,right or religious.Any doctrine that threatens the safety,well being and the lives of fellow human beings,forfeits its rights to exist in its present form.

See,you miss the point entirely.Everybody has the right to freedom of expression,and it is a free society's duty to make sure those freedoms are upheld.So even though Facism was defeated,Facists still have the freedom to be who they are and say what they want,because that IS Democracy after all.
What they do not have is the right to shove their expression in my face and Force me to witness it.
Somewhere along the line someone loses out when it comes to personal freedoms.So lets make sure that its the bad guy that misses out.You know,the guy who had his chance to show us what he was all about, and he blew it ,taking the lives, along the way ,of millions of innocent people.

I can live with that,no problem.If you cannot,then you need to find another planet to live on man because,like it or not.Thats the way it is.

 

[Lean]

Second, I do not agree with Di canio's views, but I agree that until he's actually breaking a rule. So far he hasn't really encited violent acts and I'm not sure there's any rule against expressing personal views. Celebs are always making reference to political or religious beliefs, no one gets their panties in a twist over that. I agree that it's an extreme view, and that politics should be left out of football and that fining him may be a necessary means to removing them from the sport. He may not stop until he knows he's hurting the club.

Doing that gesture is enciting violence by itself. The rage it causes on people, the anger, the memories. Plus that gesture is the symbol of a lot of terrible stuff : racism, xenophoby, violence towards "inferior" beings, etc.

And Lazio are the most hated club in Italy already because of stuff like that. He's already hurting the club, hence the word "Nazio". Honestly, apart from their supporters, do you really think anyone here (handled a few exceptions, of course) likes them? Personally if they went broke those last years i wouldnt give a ****.

 

[Trequartista]

Doing that gesture is enciting violence by itself. The rage it causes on people, the anger, the memories. Plus that gesture is the symbol of a lot of terrible stuff : racism, xenophoby, violence towards "inferior" beings, etc.

That's far too subjective and works on a person to person basis. How could you possibly know what emotions that gesture creates without being a fascist yourself?

And Lazio are the most hated club in Italy already because of stuff like that. He's already hurting the club, hence the word "Nazio". Honestly, apart from their supporters, do you really think anyone here (handled a few exceptions, of course) likes them? Personally if they went broke those last years i wouldnt give a ****.

I consider myself Laziale. It doesn't really make a bit of difference to me or anyone else for that matter that you wouldn't have minded seeing the club go broke. Thanks for your opinion, though. Lazio may be the most hated club in Italy, but so what? People can say what they like about Lazio, call it these oh so clever names, but I'm not a fascist or a racist and I know plenty of fans who aren't either. I stick with my club through thick and thin. Being a fan isn't about supporting the best or most liked club, at least not to me.

 

[pede54]

That's far too subjective and works on a person to person basis. How could you possibly know what emotions that gesture creates without being a fascist yourself?



Or a victim and target of Facism...........

 

[Pontiakos]

Well he's at it again....


Di Canio in a Friendly against ARIS FC (Thessalonike)......the Aris defender Tinga marked Di Canio preety hard in a friendly betwees Aris and Sisco Roma . Di Canio got up and the pitch turned into a boxing ring for a good 15 minutes.


....oddly enough the Fans of Aris FC in greek are called Αριανοι.......translated it means Arians. :fool:


for the record Aris won the game 3-2

 

[Socrates]

I agree with that. Just because black people were treated as slaves in the past doesn't mean that they are not racist. Their main channel is called Black Entertainment Television, imagine how much racist remarks would a channel called White Entertainment Television get?
QUOTE]

Sorry for bringing this back up but just about everyother channel here is white entertainment television even if it is not called that. Maybe you can explain more if I am not understanding this properly?

 

[hermolt]

Mad props for bringing up a Paolo thread.