Community of Editors - A list of cooperative patchmakers

[mrliioadin]

With that sentence (provocative and I see you took my provocation) I wanted to say that if you want a stable megapatch you have not to think about adding a lot of leagues because more leagues you add more there is the danger of crashes and of not good overall. As I said before this is the problem of everyone here that wants to make a megapatch but it does not know all the problem that FIFA could have adding a lot of leagues, countries and so on. There are few people in the fifaweb that could be able to do such a megapatch. And I'm talking about megapatches, you are talking about compilation (maybe .cmp I think) and this is very different. And it is possibly more tricky because I'm very curious to see how many people are able to install the different cmp leagues properly and link all the tournaments as they should. Not talking then about problems of continuing manager mode after some years... How many editers of those who create .cmp or want to organize megapatches know that, not to have problems in manager mode, you have to create a young player for every single player you add?
If you want to do a compilation of leagues with .cmp do it, but then don't be astonished when lot of users will tell you that they are not able to continue manager mode after 2nd, 3rd year.
I think a megapatch should start with the make-up of already present leagues and with the adding of the most important leagues that most of the people wants. Then, little by little, the megapatch can be updated with new leagues but starting from good and quality basis.
Then, if you want only to play friendly matches the compilation is good But you can't really think my site or other sites could join such a ridicolous project

You are right: just because this is not a job, I don't want to waste my time to help a project where other editers don't share my vision or at least my love for a quality patch.

It is fine to say that adding more leagues makes the possiblity of crashes increase. It is not alright to call an entire nations league useless... That's what I took issue with.

And lets not forget that the thead topic says nothing about a mega patch or a compilation patch... Simply the sharing of work. Others here began discussing a compilation or mega patch and I simply asked "what do you guys think would make a good compilation patch".

I didn't claim my way was best, I put out suggestions and asked for your input.

The thread asks for those interested in sharing their work. You can either agree or disagree.

You can agree and make some special requests.

But if you don't agree with what we're doing (which to clarify our project: creating an understood agreement between patch and asset makers to share work) then that's your choice and you can continue what you're doing.

The point of this is, if we quit remaking each others work we'll get a hell of a lot more done. There is no need for us to have two different kit makers make the same kit for the same team in the same year yet it happens all of the time. There is no reason that we couldn't combine a few small patches to add more than just one league to the game at a time. Stop fighting for your own glory and start helping others. That's the point of releasing your work is it not?

Plus, if a patchmaker or kitmaker just flat out sucks, teach him some stuff about patchmaking or kitmaking. Don't just blow off his work because it isn't up to your high standards. I had one problem with the CEP patches and that was that it was incompatible with Creation Master or Create Centre. Other than that, bravo for trying! Just because there were problems with the patch is no reason to forsake a project.

 

[cmc211]

Out of topic but, how many files we can add on FIFA 09?

 

[mrliioadin]

Out of topic but, how many files we can add on FIFA 09?

It depends on what type of file more than anything. Generally the fifa.fat file has a limit to how much can be added.

What I would propose is starting with a league, one of the more popular ones like Russia, argentina or something like that. Get it working with manager mode and completing a 15 year career. Once that is achieved, release it then try to add one more. If we are careful about how it's done we may make some progress on a compilation patch. But again, I think this thread needs to get back on topic. Perhaps another thread should be opened for the discussion of compilation patches.

 

[Outsider 87]

The point of this is, if we quit remaking each others work we'll get a hell of a lot more done. There is no need for us to have two different kit makers make the same kit for the same team in the same year yet it happens all of the time. There is no reason that we couldn't combine a few small patches to add more than just one league to the game at a time. Stop fighting for your own glory and start helping others. That's the point of releasing your work is it not?

Plus, if a patchmaker or kitmaker just flat out sucks, teach him some stuff about patchmaking or kitmaking. Don't just blow off his work because it isn't up to your high standards. I had one problem with the CEP patches and that was that it was incompatible with Creation Master or Create Centre. Other than that, bravo for trying! Just because there were problems with the patch is no reason to forsake a project.

These are only words, good words and nothing else. The truth is much more different and complicated... I'm the first to admire the CEP patch and the large amount of work made by Ochkam who I know quite well. One of the main problems who made him not taking other database patches was the incongruences between overalls and the high risk of crashes: it was more easy and safe for him to remake the work on his own than correcting other patches problems...
What you are saying is non-sense: you can't really think I should join a bad project waisting my time. As you and me said I'm not here for money and this is not a job: so I cannot waiste my FIFA time for something that is made wrong from the beginning. I'm always available for help for any project (every other editer who worked with me, knows it) and to give advice: but to give my and my site active contribution is a different matter: we have also our site project and we will not throw away those projects until we will see a very good reason to throw them away.
I'M THE FIRST ONE TO HELP OTHERS, so STOP talking me about glory and so on. I help others if they ask me for help and they show me they have the will to make a good patch: I cannot share my time with someone who makes a league in 2 hours!!! I can help him to make him understand how to make a good job, but I don't have always time for it: there are a lot of tools now and a good job can be done without a lot of effort but with a lot of passion and time! Here we are talking about supposed editers that should be able to edit: if they are not this is a different thing and surely I can help them: but of course they cannot start with a league patch! When I started editing I started editing the ita.db file, then I tried to understand how to edit other aspects. Now because of Creation Master all think to be able to make league patches easily and as first patch when maybe they don't even know what fifa files they are touching!
And stop also trait me as a racist or something like that: Burundi league is less important than other european leagues of course. This is due to its position, its football history, its money or whatever you want. When Burundi will become a good league it will be take into consideration also by EA SPORTS before me. I think there are more argentinian and russian (Zenit fans first!!!) and greek fans who are angry because they don't have their league ingame than Burundi ones.

I stop here because I'm tired to try to explain you something that maybe you cannot understand. Let's come back in topic!

P.S: In a very short time I will leave fifa editing. If you want mate I will teach you whatever you want and I know about fifa games. Then, maybe, you will understand better my point of view.

 

[mrliioadin]

What you are saying is non-sense: you can't really think I should join a bad project waisting my time. As you and me said I'm not here for money and this is not a job: so I cannot waiste my FIFA time for something that is made wrong from the beginning.

Again, what project? There is no project! This thread is about sharing work and how best to do that. THERE IS NO PROJECT. Nor did I ever say anything about money. Not once.

I'M THE FIRST ONE TO HELP OTHERS, so STOP talking me about glory and so on.

Nor did I say anything about glory

I help others if they ask me for help and they show me they have the will to make a good patch

How can they show you they will make a good patch if they have never made one before?!? The first step is to make a bad patch, that's how you learn.

I cannot share my time with someone who makes a league in 2 hours!!! I can help him to make him understand how to make a good job, but I don't have always time for it: there are a lot of tools now and a good job can be done without a lot of effort but with a lot of passion and time!

You misunderstand, I never asked you to join or sign. I made a thread to find people who share my ideal for sharing work. I've defended the idea but I never said, "You should sign". So no one here asked for your help. The only thing we've done is pointed out the disadvantages of not sharing your work.

Here we are talking about supposed editers that should be able to edit: if they are not this is a different thing and surely I can help them: but of course they cannot start with a league patch! When I started editing I started editing the ita.db file, then I tried to understand how to edit other aspects. Now because of Creation Master all think to be able to make league patches easily and as first patch when maybe they don't even know what fifa files they are touching!

The way you did it isn't the only way to do it. If Bob from leichtenstein wants his local league made, who's gonna make it for him! We constantly critisize people who frequently request leagues, teams, kits etc. People need to make these patches for themselves even if they suck. That's how you learn.

And stop also trait me as a racist or something like that:

Woah, I never said anything of the sort. This is a flat out false allegation. What I critisized was that you called them useless. I don't know you well enough to make any claims about your perceptions of other races. Based on what I do know of you, you are highly tolerant and I would never suspect you of being racist. Be careful here, We can disagree and even disagree passionately without going down this road. It's good for us to disagree, but let's be clear, I have no perception of you being racist. I just disagreed with what you said.

Burundi league is less important than other european leagues of course. This is due to its position, its football history, its money or whatever you want.

I agreed with all of that. But you called the league useless. That's different than the quote above. Less important is different than useless.

I stop here because I'm tired to try to explain you something that maybe you cannot understand. Let's come back in topic!

Don't try to attack my intelligence. We can and should disagree without cheap shots. Come on man.

In a very short time I will leave fifa editing. If you want mate I will teach you whatever you want and I know about fifa games. Then, maybe, you will understand better my point of view.

You are concerned about the quality of these patches, that's a valid concern. I am concerned about the quantity of patches available. Generally you would be right quality > quantity. The reason I disagree is because of the massive number of leagues and teams that exists in the world that don't have any representation in EA Sports or SG. I urge new members make their local league NOW, release a bad patch and learn a bit about doing it, then continue to update it for the rest of the year. In 2010 their patch will be easier to convert and update and will be a higher quality. In 2011 it will be even better. If people start editing NOW, they've got a year's experience before next season and they are making leagues that NO ONE ELSE WILL MAKE. No one has to download them, so if you have a problem with the quantity, just don't download it.

The best way to get quality patches is to train more potential patchmakers now. Think of it like a 3 year plan.

 

[billy_d04nk5]

I'm here just wanna say.... "Wow,, what a Long Thread you have here.."

sorry,,

 

[mogolos]

I'm here just wanna say.... "Wow,, what a Long Thread you have here.."

sorry,,

yes mate, you are right! It is the best blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah thread, I love it! The only thing u can not find here is Fifa! It look likes a puplic MSN, or a forum with subject "Tabula Rasa".

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

 

[billy_d04nk5]

yes mate, you are right! It is the best blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah thread, I love it! The only thing u can not find here is Fifa! It look likes a puplic MSN, or a forum with subject "Tabula Rasa".

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

Wow,,, What a very,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,,,,very,, Long thread you have now

hey,, MogoLos,, we're not childish aren't we?

 

[snoppf1]

Great idea

My CL patch is finished for 1st release anyone can use it as long as they credit me

 

[cmc211]

Come back to original way of thread
bla bla bla

 

[Outsider 87]

The best way to get quality patches is to train more potential patchmakers now. Think of it like a 3 year plan.

I think mate we have talked about 3 different things that cannot be easily related. One is the contribution of my work for the editers (experienced one I think) who want to use my patch to make their patch better. The second is a compilation patch and the third one is training new patchmakers. According to me in NO case these 3 things can be melt because:
1) a new patchmaker has to be trained as you said: with a lot of patience. So his work can't appear in a megapatch not only for the low quality but also not to give him too much responsibility... Moreover this thread does not match with this intent or better: not for the kind of editer like me. I'm not a graphic editer that makes kits or flags. If I was I surely would let people use my kits in their patches even if they are at their first patch. But a new patchmaker doesn't need at all my works because I think he will make a .cmp and quite all my creations cannot be inserted in a .cmp
2) if, when you talk about compilation, you talk only about a thread where all .cmp leagues are rejoined I have already told you what is the problem. And of course it's right to let every editer contribute if he wants, even with his Burundi league.
3) you cannot pretend that I let other patchmakers insert in their patches my patches without looking at how they make the patch and what is the global quality. Not because I'm the best, but only because I think that my work is decent and I want my decent work be inserted in another decent work. I think you perfectly understand that a work of months cannot be inserted in a work of 2 hours...
4) Finally you talked about competition in a forum: in a forum there could be competition but there should be the will of helping people to do better and to train new patchmakers. On the other side you have to understand that there is a competition between the different websites and so some patches cannot be for free use by everyone: not because we are bad people, but only because our site lives of downloads and its popularity is due mainly to the number of downloads and to the competence and kindness of their members (especially if they own also a forum, not only a site). Moreover we, as italian site, are very concerned on training new italian editers and we do it in our forums. So we already contribute a lot to the fifaweb health. And I think this is the same for other websites, I'm sure about it!
What I think it's not clear is that having a site and belonging to that site is something much different to be a member of a forum like this. Belonging to a site is like belonging to a family and no one wants to break the family Staff members are like the parents of the children (our users) of the family: they works to give something to eat to the children. We work hard to make our patches and we work hard and waiste time to, at least, seeing that the work is appreciated and downloaded (something to eat): it's very difficult and expensive to work also to give something to eat also to other families
Sometimes we can give something, but not always
And this is counter-productive to work and then looking at someone eating at our place Why we should keep a site without downloads? No downloads? No users!

At the end I really hope this thread will have a lot of agreements especially from graphic makers and face makers because I know that it's very annoying to ask everyone to use their creation and so also my work could be easier if they sign in such an agreement

 

[mrliioadin]

The only thing that I don't think you aren't entirely clear on is that we didn't come to you and ask you for your patches. We aren't pressuring you to give them to us. We never really wanted them. We aren't here to collect patches. We are here to find out who is interested in working together. You have expressed that you are not interested in this in the way that I stated above. That's fine, it doesn't make our idea a bad one.

Instead we created a public thread related to sharing patches and assets in general and you came here and posted. I disagree with the idea behind making patches and not letting others use them. But this was never specific to you. I do agree that new patchmakers should have their work edited to improve the quality (I further edit every patch that someone sends me for national teams). I constantly update my old patches too because some of them still need a lot of work.

We have discussed a compilation patch and how difficult that may be to put together. I think we only disagree on whether it should be done or not. But we both agreed it's off topic so we should lay that topic to bed.

The only thing I said about new patchmakers was that they should be encouraged to make patches irregarless of the quality, because they can always be improved. Creating them in the first place is the really hard part.

But I do want to make it incredibly clear. No one here has asked for your patches.

I appreciate the sentiment that you are looking for us to do well.

 

[Outsider 87]

All my long replies (and talking about megapatches) were given to answer to myx first post against my decision. That was the first post that made me try explaining you some things...I know perfectly what is the aim of this topic: I read the first post when I posted my first post here. It was myx reaction that had to be answered by me

For me is fine and I hope you will find a lot of people for this agreement. For me if you want something from me just ask me and don't take without asking: that's clear enough!

Bye

 

[jschuck12001]

Thanks to those who get it

I have never posted before but have been coming to this site and many others for years to help build my game every year. I thank all patch makers as I would have stopped buying fifa years ago if it werent for Rinaldo and all you you patch makers because frankly the game sucks without depth. Before I throw some of you under the bus I want to say thanks for your patches, I love Outsiders stuff and dont want to come off as as a donkey but if you need to get respect from making patches then you have a serious void in your life. I understand you spend alot of time and I appreciate that but you dont get paid so you must have a passion for being a patch maker. That alone should drive you to keep making patches or stop, it shouldnt be a respect thing. I laugh so much at some of the posts where people are fighting over who stole what and I say to myself," without the core game, nobody would be making anything" my point is that it has become an issue and it will prevent a truly great patch from being developed. I would pay $75 maybe more for a fifa game that had all the leagues in CEP plus more of the middle eastern, asian, concacaf leagues and the african league. I'm not even talking about deep leagues, just 1st division with all the major leagues and continental club cups. We can always fine tune it from there with CM. Why dont the major continental Fifa sites get together and make it happen, start charging a membership fee to your website and then you get all content for download, there are ways around worrying about EA. I already know of many sites that do this for FLIGHT SIMULATOR, I think it would actually boost sales of FIFA because more people would know that they will have a fully functioning, non buggy FIFA that had texture quality and extreme depth so you can enjoy playing in all regions of the world. FIFA 09 sold over 1.2 million copies its first week released. There is money to be had for those of you with talents. Someone needs to step up, grab their sack and take a chance to try to collaborate this thing.

 

[Outsider 87]

Why dont the major continental Fifa sites get together and make it happen, start charging a membership fee to your website and then you get all content for download, there are ways around worrying about EA. I already know of many sites that do this for FLIGHT SIMULATOR, I think it would actually boost sales of FIFA because more people would know that they will have a fully functioning, non buggy FIFA that had texture quality and extreme depth so you can enjoy playing in all regions of the world. FIFA 09 sold over 1.2 million copies its first week released. There is money to be had for those of you with talents. Someone needs to step up, grab their sack and take a chance to try to collaborate this thing.

We cannot make money with patches because we don't pay rights for them to anyone: not to nike, to adidas and so on...
I don't want to get respect from fifa patches, I want to get gratitude: and this is an hard thing to achieve especially with actual users who only think about downloading and having, never think about giving something like a "thanks" word. And I want to keep a site alive. It's the main objective of every site who lives with downloads (no downloads, no users, no need to keep the site) and maybe some adverts... more people talk about my patch, more publicity for my site: it's easy to understand!
I don't want to get respect, I want that people respect the hours I spend on making things and this is why you see people arguing about stealing things. I don't think you would be happy if someone changes the template of your kit and claims it is his own kit. Isn't it?

 

[mrliioadin]

I don't think you would be happy if someone changes the template of your kit and claims it is his own kit. Isn't it?

Remember that no one is endorsing taking someone's work as if it were their own. All patches and everything should be credited and I have yet to see anyone dispute that. This point is moot.

But jschuck12001 has a point. We steal all of EAs work and build from there...

 

[cmc211]

We steal all of EAs work and build from there...

It is true for us.

We cannot make money with patches

Unfortunately, In our country, we pay money for big patches. But those money not go to patchers, It goes to webhard owners!

 

[myx]

cmc211, Do not talk ****. Its impossible to pay for patches becose we dont have copyrights and we can sold.

 

[cmc211]

cmc211, Do not talk ****. Its impossible to pay for patches becose we dont have copyrights and we can sold.

The reason is that, free download is slow so people prefer to download 0.1~0.5$ to download patch.

 

[billy_d04nk5]

guys,,

In indonesia, people can earn money by selling their patches.

but it's all because there are a lot of people who doesn't know how to make those patches

and maybe I am the first Indonesian in this forum.

by the way..
making patches is not my job,, just for fun