How should I call this video? Lots of c**p ;)

[regularcat]

Fidel has released some fabulous gameplay mods that rival anything jenkey and yair and whoever release over at EvoWeb.

The keys to FIFA 12 are:

Edit CPU tactics to create some CPU defensive pressure when you have the ball. Raise CPU defense aggression to at least 80. Also, raise the CPU man marking slider to at least 80 as well. You'll see tighter CPU defending and more CPU fouls will be called.

When creating custom CPU tactics, lower play buildup to as low as 1 for many CPU teams. That change alone makes a huge difference to the look and feel of the CPU play. And for anyone who does player editing, try this with a CPU team and test it out: set players' dribbling skill to between 50 and 65 for every player. That edit will stop a lot of the standard, typical FIFA-style nonsense where every CPU winger dribbles up the sideline and into the corner, and then crosses to a teammate in the box.

I use these tweaks and edits in conjunction with Fidel's GP Evo mod and I really can't say enough about how good this game is. And I've been a diehard PES footballer for years. FIFA 12 is not perfect, but after some editing it's very decent and a ton of fun.

yea & then every team plays the same, you just dont understand the gripes people who have played fifa for years are discussing here.

you just assume by editing 2 values for all teams will fix it but it just makes it worse.

we want realistic team play w/ realistic football behavior, not a sacrifice of one for the other, this isnt pes.

 

[CoreyR]

Online Play

How do I get my games to be ranked and accumulate stats and keep a record?

Thanks

 

[bangus]

yea & then every team plays the same, you just dont understand the gripes people who have played fifa for years are discussing here.

you just assume by editing 2 values for all teams will fix it but it just makes it worse.

No, every team does not play the same. You create a couple dozen different CPU tactic templates and assign them to different teams. Set aggression at 80 for one team, 90 for another, 100 for another. Set play buildup anywhere from 1-50 for teams. You'll end up playing against an assortment of different pressure and attack styles.

Couldn't be happier with what I'm seeing with this game after Fidel's mods and a few CPU tactics tweaks. Can't for the life of me understand what you could possibly mean by "it only makes it worse." All of the above only greatly improves the gameplay.

 

[jschuck12001]

Fidel has released some fabulous gameplay mods that rival anything jenkey and yair and whoever release over at EvoWeb.

The keys to FIFA 12 are:

Edit CPU tactics to create some CPU defensive pressure when you have the ball. Raise CPU defense aggression to at least 80. Also, raise the CPU man marking slider to at least 80 as well. You'll see tighter CPU defending and more CPU fouls will be called.

When creating custom CPU tactics, lower play buildup to as low as 1 for many CPU teams. That change alone makes a huge difference to the look and feel of the CPU play. And for anyone who does player editing, try this with a CPU team and test it out: set players' dribbling skill to between 50 and 65 for every player. That edit will stop a lot of the standard, typical FIFA-style nonsense where every CPU winger dribbles up the sideline and into the corner, and then crosses to a teammate in the box.

I use these tweaks and edits in conjunction with Fidel's GP Evo mod and I really can't say enough about how good this game is. And I've been a diehard PES footballer for years. FIFA 12 is not perfect, but after some editing it's very decent and a ton of fun.

I was more speaking to adding leagues/tournaments as opposed to gameplay. I actually like the gameplay the way it is but it burns me that I cannot edit FIFA the way I want to.

 

[bangus]

it burns me that I cannot edit FIFA the way I want to.

Fair enough. I've felt that way many times with different sports games, and EA is traditionally about the worst when it comes to editing options and allowing user customization. It's the reason I switched from console gaming to PC gaming a year ago. Many more customization possibilities.

 

[regularcat]

No, every team does not play the same. You create a couple dozen different CPU tactic templates and assign them to different teams. Set aggression at 80 for one team, 90 for another, 100 for another. Set play buildup anywhere from 1-50 for teams. You'll end up playing against an assortment of different pressure and attack styles.

Couldn't be happier with what I'm seeing with this game after Fidel's mods and a few CPU tactics tweaks. Can't for the life of me understand what you could possibly mean by "it only makes it worse." All of the above only greatly improves the gameplay.

because again the reality & point of my post escapes you bro.

by altering the values or even assigning them different sets of custom tactics is still changing the way a team plays.

if you want to play a team that builds up slow & defends w/ less aggression by altering via custom tactics, the team doesnt play like their real life counter parts.

we want realistic football behavior, tactics & mind sets of real life counterparts.

its not an impossibility to create, they just dont do it, they once had individual ini files for players to make them play more life like.
you would know this is you were a true fifa fan.

im not saying your not capable of sharing your opinion, but compared to fifa players who have played only fifa, your words are almost invalid because w/ this being
your first & main fifa experience your posts regarding this almost have no value to us due to your lack of knowing how fifa has been developed throughout the years.

people argue what they want in the game & ea has to be split amongst them, some want simulation & some want arcade style play.

if ea says this is a simulation then they need to make it that way & tell the arcade style to go play pes.

clearly you left pes for the better & more realistic sim called fifa 12, but by doing what you are doing from a reality standpoint you are basically converting fifa to pes & also contradicting the reason you switched to begin w/.

 

[bangus]

by altering the values or even assigning them different sets of custom tactics is still changing the way a team plays.

If that was a real concern, nobody would do any editing or touch any of the default team or player values, period. Bottomline, the default tactics are all wrong to start with and need to be fixed. All CPU teams in the game are too attack-orientated with the ball, and not aggressive enough when defending. Adjust CPU tactics, set them to something realistic, and you can have teams more or less play the way they're supposed to in real life. Some player edits are also required. Simply editing the DB or Product file won't fix the core issues with the game unfortunately. It takes a bit of effort but it improves the gameplay 300%. And it's much more realistic as I said.

 

[info0]

If that was a real concern, nobody would do any editing or touch any of the default team or player values, period. Bottomline, the default tactics are all wrong to start with and need to be fixed. All CPU teams in the game are too attack-orientated with the ball, and not aggressive enough when defending. Adjust CPU tactics, set them to something realistic, and you can have teams more or less play the way they're supposed to in real life. Some player edits are also required. Simply editing the DB or Product file won't fix the core issues with the game unfortunately. It takes a bit of effort but it improves the gameplay 300%. And it's much more realistic as I said.

This bro. You got one point better at understanding what I don't like about FIFA.

This, about assigning custom tactics and real life formations have been discussed for many years on consoles actually, there is ever Realistic Tactic Project going on.

However, this is something EA Sports should have done when game was released and not users to do. I don't have time to edit God knows how many teams to play like they do IRL. I buy a game, I demand teams in it to at least try to play in realistic way.

What did you get when you bought the game? Without editing sliders, setting difficulty to Pro/World Class/Legendary. Well, you got to play vs Barcelona style of play every time...

Even Norwich/Swansea/Wisla Krakow played like Barcelona... You serious? This is wrong. And what's with CPU pass accuracy of 85-95%? Even with ****ty teams? Unfortunately, here you can't do anything. Even with pass error slider at 100 (isn't pass error slider wronly named too btw?) you will just see ball bobbling more, not accuracy going down.

And what regularcat wrote is spot on too.

 

[bangus]

I don't have time to edit God knows how many teams to play like they do IRL. I buy a game, I demand teams in it to at least try to play in realistic way.

This I completely understand, and I get the complaints regarding the default gameplay: it stinks. And most of that is just lazy programming on the devs' part as I see it. And I certainly don't expect people to not complain about it, given the game should play much more realistically out of the box. Any comments I make are simply meant as suggestions to anyone who might have the time to try a few tweaks in order to fix some of those gameplay problems.

 

[regularcat]

If that was a real concern, nobody would do any editing or touch any of the default team or player values, period. Bottomline, the default tactics are all wrong to start with and need to be fixed. All CPU teams in the game are too attack-orientated with the ball, and not aggressive enough when defending. Adjust CPU tactics, set them to something realistic, and you can have teams more or less play the way they're supposed to in real life. Some player edits are also required. Simply editing the DB or Product file won't fix the core issues with the game unfortunately. It takes a bit of effort but it improves the gameplay 300%. And it's much more realistic as I said.

i have edited all teams to play like they would if you were watching them on tv.

This I completely understand, and I get the complaints regarding the default gameplay: it stinks. And most of that is just lazy programming on the devs' part as I see it. And I certainly don't expect people to not complain about it, given the game should play much more realistically out of the box. Any comments I make are simply meant as suggestions to anyone who might have the time to try a few tweaks in order to fix some of those gameplay problems.

its not that the devs are lazy, the devs dont watch enough teams play & just dont know football well enough to replicate a realistic ai, which is where r&d comes into the process of creating a realistic ai.

if you ask me all the money they make & the money they pay people to watch players for adjustments of stats w/ new squad updates, they should also pay them to watch how teams play as a whole in order to make teams play more realistically.

they base there game off of one league & assume they all play the same way which is ridiculous, leagues full of players w/ less talent then say the epl has shouldnt play the way the epl teams & players play.

they need to reincorporate individual player ai like they used to have in previous fifa titles.

 

[Waldo1639]

The movement of the players is very robotic, it doesnt feel smooth as FIFA does. Im not a FIFA fan boy either, I usually play PES until modding tools are released for FIFA and I like the fact they have all tourneys liscensed and graphics are nasty on my Sony. Last year I found it to be unplayable and this year it was a litlle better but only played for a few minutes then uninstalled PES Edit patch shortly after that.

PES 2011 was bad, I agree with that, but 2012 made a decent job in improving all aspects of gameplay.

As about robotic movements... FIFA 12 have robotic movements, PES have "childish or so" animations, and they are, for me, main problem. But as info0 said:

I don't care about PES 2012 animations, like I said in PES video on my channel. They are behind FIFA in that aspect and everyone accepts that fact. Same stuff as with licenses. You get on with limitations certain titles offer.

But AI in this years Pro Evo beats absolutely every FIFA or for that matter any football/sports game released. I don't know HOW they did it, but what KONAMI pulled off in 1 year time is beyond awesome. Teammates do what you expect them to do, run when you expect them to run, position themselves HOW you would love them to. Opposition WILL attack you and NOT let the occassion to score pass by (on FIFA, many many times I have seen AI player going 1 on 1 vs my defender doing what? Passing the ball back... Give me a break).

Why the f**k FIFA moders have to work hard every year on improving FIFA gameplay if it's that "good"...??? Because it's not good.

Regularcat said many times way before that we want realistic AI by default EA gameplay, not that moders have to improve it, or that we slide some sliders to make game better.

If one moder (Erevos, Reg, Fidel...), who doesn't have resources like EA programmers have, can make gameplay improvement on the level which is very close to realistic, then a professional team can also do it.

KONAMI make patches based on players feedback, and there is already next patch coming soon. They listen what is needed to improve and then eventually they fix it. Take note EA!

FIFA 11 is much better then 12. I enjoyed it, but FIFA 12 made me to play PES this year, and I'm glad that EA f***ed up, cause now I enjoy in PES.

We can only hope from EA to improve next year.

 

[bangus]

Why the f**k FIFA moders have to work hard every year on improving FIFA gameplay if it's that "good"...??? Because it's not good.

FIFA 12 made me to play PES this year, and I'm glad that EA f***ed up, cause now I enjoy in PES.

So your argument is FIFA 12 should be great out of the box, and because it isn't you decided to play a totally broken and even worse game in PES 2012. That makes no sense at all.

 

[jeetmusic]

i have edited all teams to play like they would if you were watching them on tv.

realy..??????



i

 

[Waldo1639]

So your argument is FIFA 12 should be great out of the box, and because it isn't you decided to play a totally broken and even worse game in PES 2012. That makes no sense at all.

PES gameplay is not broken, or worse then FIFA 12 gameplay in any term. With FIFA's enormous background, history and financial resources there should be much better presentation of football game then we have now.

Look just Impact Engine and it fails. How many times have others requested improvements of players behavior in original gameplay of FIFA 12? Do you find features like "improved and hyped" career mode great, when Messi is transfered in first season to Real Madrid, and other impossible transfers? Do you find great when Messi do tricks he never perform in real life and when defenders in weaker teams do tricks that are perform only by class attackers? It's just for example.

I decided to play PES cause I enjoy it better then FIFA 12. I cant find any feature better that will gain me back to play it. You play what is more enjoyable for you, right?

If you find PES 2012 as a very bad, it's ok, I respect that. We all have different taste and look on things. But did you give PES a chance, and tried career mode?

And do you play FIFA 12 with original gameplay or you use mod?

I play FIFA from 2001, and will still continue to play it and discuss about it. Some of my best matches I played were in FIFA, but in PES also.

Do not misunderstood me, I do not hate FIFA, neither do spit on it or have attacked you in any way. This is just discussion.

 

[bangus]

Do not misunderstood me, I do not hate FIFA, neither do spit on it or have attacked you in any way. This is just discussion.

No problem. I'm older gamer and I long ago dropped that juvenile "hate this particular game" routine. I appreciate both games for what they are. PES 2011 was IMO the best football game I'd ever played after installed yair's patch... up until I played FIFA 12 that is. I only buy games for the PC, so I had to rent PES 2012 for the console (I seldom buy games without renting first). I just couldn't believe what an ugly mess it was. It's always one step forward and two back with Konami. That plus the PESFan site has an 80 page complaint thread, and everyone who posts in there say the same thing about the broken shooting, passing, goalkeeping, etc. And it could be that jenkey or yair's gameplay patches help fix the PC version somewhat. But it's hard to believe they could change it that much.

 

[Waldo1639]

No problem. I'm older gamer and I long ago dropped that juvenile "hate this particular game" routine. I appreciate both games for what they are. PES 2011 was IMO the best football game I'd ever played after installed yair's patch... up until I played FIFA 12 that is. I only buy games for the PC, so I had to rent PES 2012 for the console (I seldom buy games without renting first). I just couldn't believe what an ugly mess it was. It's always one step forward and two back with Konami. That plus the PESFan site has an 80 page complaint thread, and everyone who posts in there say the same thing about the broken shooting, passing, goalkeeping, etc. And it could be that jenkey or yair's gameplay patches help fix the PC version somewhat. But it's hard to believe they could change it that much.

I'm glad we understand each other.

PES has also his faults, no doubt about it. I can say that besides animation one more thing is bothering me in PES - You don't have player and pass control as in FIFA. This "player felling" is a bit distanced, don't know how to explain it, but I'll enjoy it gameplay till FIFA 13.

Let's hope for better days.
Cheers!

 

[info0]

Sorry, I wasn't visiting Soccergaming that much these days. Of course there is no neglecting PES 2012 having it own problems. First of which is AI cheating script visible on every corner. Fortunately for us, PC gamers, there is yair25 patch (which I recommend over jenkey tool) which is now in final version on evo-web forums. It gets rid of AI cheating, makes animation kick in time better, so you see smoother transition in animations, fixes GK reactions, shooting power, etc.

There was one thing lacking due to AI cheating, that made PES for many years, player individuality and team own style of gameplay. Unfortunately something went very wrong this year and was omitted. Most probable case was tsunami in Japan.

Hopefully, according to WENB (now official KONAMI UK feedback partner), Kojima (Metal Gear Solid and Rising also Project Orge official producer) and Seabass (PES director :P), there will be substantial change in PES 2013. Due to Kojima making new engine for his Project Orge. There is high probablity that parts of it and animations will be used in PES 2013. According to Seabass PES 2013 will be something different, something new.

OF course it's early in the days, so I am not taking anything for granted yet. Until I see footage, play beta myself, etc.

As for FIFA 12, like I said, it's more like testing for next release. You should take note on FIFA boards on EA forums. There is so much feedback being sent to Rutter of what to improve/get rid off (heated discussion about sliders)/re-do (again sliders should be locked at certain values to make cheating not possible, some should be re-done because they don't do what they are intended to, there should be in depth explanation of what each slider does and how they work. Becaue they don't work in % values that's for sure!). It's amazing.

Only FIFA devs and Rutter know what FIFA 13 will be. Seeing how each year FIFA changes or brings in new features, we can assume it will be v. good, but it needs new graphic style. That's the thing I love in Pro Evo btw with Firepatch. You can distinguish players on each camera easily. On close ups... they look God damn real.

 

[info0]

One more question is it me or do the players in FIFA 12 feel super heavy? They have no lightness to them, they feel like friggin' tanks...

Where the hell have FIFA 11 players mobility gone to?!

 

[Waldo1639]

Hopefully, according to WENB (now official KONAMI UK feedback partner), Kojima (Metal Gear Solid and Rising also Project Orge official producer) and Seabass (PES director :P), there will be substantial change in PES 2013. Due to Kojima making new engine for his Project Orge. There is high probablity that parts of it and animations will be used in PES 2013. According to Seabass PES 2013 will be something different, something new.

OF course it's early in the days, so I am not taking anything for granted yet. Until I see footage, play beta myself, etc.

Well, that's good news if guys from KONAMI will do substantial change in PES. I think they should do it or tweak a lot current engine.

Project Ogre will be based on Fox Engine, right? Which should be also visually awesome. Hideo Kojima is a genius, I like this guy, mostly cause I'm totally crazy about MGS. But it'll be nice to some parts of Fox Engine into PES, cause Kojima have big plans for it.

 

[johnblack5410]

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