SG Draft Competition--First Knockout 4

[Arnau]

Which leaves Busquets a huge space to cover alone because Kagawa is more a forward than a midfielder. Legio can easy disorganize Sons of Pitches by pass.

 

[ShiftyPowers]

What kind of passes? None of the guys in the final third can pass. They dribble and run.

 

[Arnau]

aaaand good team doesn't dissociate attack from defense, when they attack are also preparing to defend and vice versa. Attacking with both fullbacks is also defending from wingers.

 

[Arnau]

What kind of passes? None of the guys in the final third can pass. They dribble and run.

Mandanda to Thiago Silva, Sahin first receiver means ball will end up with advantage at De Rossi, Verratti or Belhanda feet, then those moving (the ball and opponent) from right to left, up and down, until the rival disorganize (eliminating any counter-attack chance) and the hole appears.

 

[ShiftyPowers]

That team ain't Barcelona. The attackers aren't coming back to overload midfield and create space. The forwards are looking to beat the offside trap and Belhanda is going to dribble.

 

[Mandieta6]

can't blame me for Jogi Löw's starting XI selections, or the fact that my system isn't his ... but I picked Höwedes for his ability to handle the CB/RB role, and he's good for it ...

and what is top level to you? coz I don't rate the Prem, but I won't deny it's share at the top level ... Champions League is top level? quarters and semis, more so, no doubt?

Last 16 of the CL. A player playing at the top level is one who consistently plays against the level of sides that reach this stage of the competition. Howedes is on the edge.

yeah, pre-season shows nothing ... it's just a PR stunt ... how could I forget?

Not a PR-stunt, but players are not focused on the result, and most do not perform to the top of their abilities. Judging a player based on his pre-season performances is laughable.

yup, exactly, it's not fact ... so "unproven" isn't a criterion ... but your projection of his ability is ... and it's not clear what part of your projection for Verratti and Belhanda makes them lesser players ...

My projection of their abilities is my opinion, it is not fact. My opinion is my criteria. And I would classify this competition, the level of play expected from these sets of players, to be of the top level (the one I mentioned earlier). A lot of players shine at lower levels and fail at this one. When analysing players who are unproven at this level, I consider a percentage of risk involved. It represents the chance that these players might not perform at this level. Players who have demonstrated their ability at the top do not require such, let's say, 'risk-analysis deductions'.

Big fish in a small pond could be a big fish in a big pond, but it could also be a small fish. At this level, at this level, at this level.

it's always a case-by-case basis, so I reject the notion of always assuming a player will necessarily be worse-off upon return ...

That's your prerogative. It's similar to the 'at this level' deal above, the deduction part. I don't think it's a case by case basis, it's physical. Players need to play, to compete and to train in order to keep at the best of their abilities. By not doing those things, and I'm not even considering the fact that their bodies will be in worse condition, they cannot be at their best when they return to fitness. Sometimes the player is so good, and his teammates/opposition so poor, that it doesn't matter, but in this context, I expect these players to be a disadvantage. At first, at least.

hah, the only reason you're recycling your Di Natale argument is coz you're still pissed about it ... but it doesn't apply here ... Torres wasn't alpha dog at Liverpool, Stevie G was ...

I do think it was bull****, and find it funny that you claim me to be prejudiced after you made that bull**** analysis, but that's beside the point. The term was never 'alpha dog', but 'focal point/star'. And you're disregarding this point. Torres was the focus of his sides' attack, as the main striker, not as a dictator of play, at every side he has shined at (Atletico, Liverpool, sometimes Spain, this years' Chelsea,maybe), and has struggled whenever he had to share this status (with Villa, or Drogba). Here, he has to share. Torres' loss of form is psychological, this issue will aggravate this problem.

yeah, context ... NOT individual 1-v-1s ... De Rossi is there if the defence, on those rare occasions, is over-stretched ... my defence (not least as a unit) is amongst the best in the competition; this "destroy" bullsh!t is a joke ... you're making it obvious that your prejudice is blinding your better judgment ...

I never considered it as a 1-v-1s. It was the whole of Nady's attack, against your defense, and I think it would have beat you. Destroy is obviously an exaggeration, at this level no team will destroy another, but Nady's tactics would have exploited yours'. You have good players, but I think the system is faulty.

Look, you can call it prejudice all you want, but it's just a matter of you being unable to accept people not sharing your opinion. I think Nady would have won, if it hurts your ego so bad then sure, believe it's about prejudice.

 

[Arnau]

That team ain't Barcelona. The attackers aren't coming back to overload midfield and create space. The forwards are looking to beat the offside trap and Belhanda is going to dribble.

Doesn't Iniesta or Messi dribble? also Barcelona didn't invented positional football...


Attackers going back is against positional game, actually midfielders (insiders) put behind the opponent midfielders back to push strikers into the box. Or wingers stay wide, without moving nor participating on the play, to pin fullbacks and create space inside.

 

[ShiftyPowers]

I have no idea what you're talking about, but Belhanda is not Messi or Iniesta.

 

[Mandieta6]

I wish Arnau could speak English.

 

[Arnau]

Yeah, Belhanda is an associative player and a demon between lines...

 

[Pogba4Now]

Can't be bothered to read all the posts here but I'm sure my team will beat that team in real life. These are the sons of all pitches afterall.

Balotelli and Torres are the most unreliable strikers at the moment. Where would Legio's goals come from? Belhanda is very unproven. Many players from Ligue 1 turn out to be major failures in bigger leagues.

My defense is my weakest point, but I can't see Balotelli, Torres and Belhanda terrifying this defense. If Torres and Balotelli are gonna drop back to the wings, who will be in the CF position to score the goals?

 

[Xifio]

Torres and Mario are clutch strikers, who deliver on the big occasions ... and drifting wide works within their tactical freedom -- aka taking turns ...

Belhanda is very unproven. Many players from Ligue 1 turn out to be major failures in bigger leagues.

hahaha, what?!

 

[Pogba4Now]

Torres and Mario are clutch strikers, who deliver on the big occasions ... and drifting wide works within their tactical freedom -- aka taking turns ...

I'm not a fan of this concept TBH and I don't think it works that well.

Anyway, back to the Ligue 1 players: I think its 50-50. Players like Djibril Cisse (top scorer for Ligue 1), Bruno Cheyrou, Mahamadou Diarra, Julien Faubert (), Fabien Barthez, Chamakh etc failed badly outside of France. Gervinho and Giroud are struggling at Arsenal.

I'm not saying that Belhanda will fail in other leagues but I think it could go either way. Players like Benzema, Hazard, Ben Arfa etc are doing well abroad but I don't think Belhanda is to the same level as when these guys just left the Ligue 1.

 

[Xifio]

^ agreed about the concept ...


every league has players who fail in other leagues, but the percentages for the bigger players favour Ligue 1 positively, I feel ... apart from Djibril, and maybe Barthez, I don't think there was as much expectation for the names you mention ... just contrast it to the players who HAVE succeeded from Ligue 1 during a similar time period: Drogba, Benzema, Ribéry, Essien, Malouda, Abidal, Giuly, Seydou Keita, Evra, Nasri, Ben Arfa, and now Hazard ... even Arsenal got a Frenchman who worked out: Sagna ... I don't think you have a case ...

 

[Mandieta6]

I think barring Ribery, all the silkier wingers/attacking mids struggled to adapt at first. Barring Hazard, where the jury is still out, they all took a while to reach the level expected of them. Malouda, Benzema, Ben Arfa, Nasri, Giuly. Being a defender in a league is not the same as being an attacker, and this will affect their adaptation period in other leagues. Belhanda, as an attacker of that mould, would likely struggle at first.

 

[Sir Calumn]

My shock vote put Xifio through to the next round

 

[Pogba4Now]

You and Hitachi screwed me up. I gave you a tip about your strikers and this is how you reward me.

This is what that n00b said in this thread and he still voted for Xifio.

Huh ?? I dont know whats wrong with the guy who made Legio III but torres really ??? theres alot of better strikers to pick from like drogba. His a beast in that box with his body and he has very good experience. best striker imo

 

[Mandieta6]

Disrepute!

 

[Sir Calumn]

I honestly thought xifio was the slightly better team so perversely not voting for xifio would have made me as bad as xifio.

 

[Mandieta6]

Yeah, I get that. I would rather see Legio out early, but honestly this is better for me. I nearly voted for him just so I can face him instead of Nady.