Champions League - Last Sixteen - 2007/2008

[Filipower]

I'd find more fault in Avram if he was Portuguese, to be honest

That's because you're a moron.

But I'd say I'm about as competent as Avram:

'Drogba, Rafa dissed your cheating ass. Go and score and make sure you celebrate like you have but an ounce of class.
Terry, they sing about your mum. It's true, but just go and play and hassle the ref and dont let him book our players.
Carvalho, you and Terry have been solid for four years. 'Nuff said.
Lampard, your mother just died. I really don't need to tell you what you're playing for.
This is still Mourinho's team, so just go and play and make me look good.'

And that's because you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[pede54]

man you thought I was saying that because of Mourinho? really, I couldn't care lass if Chelsea wins or not with him or without him..what I was saying is that Chelsea got Ten Cate for a reason..

and I really try to give Grant credit, but find it hard..I just can't see what he has done that caused Chelsea's success this season, that's all..of course he has add input, I mean he is your manager after all..

OK fair enough Fili. Nobody is saying that Avram has done it all on his own. He has ten Cate and Stevie to help him out. Obviously ten Cate was brought in for his expertise otherwise why bother? Steve is there on merit too.

The success of any club in the world, only reflects the hard work that goes on behind the scenes. If it was at all possible to be a success on your own, then there would be no need whatsoever, for managers to need coaches, trainers, doctors or even a kit man.

When people talk about the success of Man U, Fergie gets the credit, not Queiroz or the other 30 people working with the team. The manager decides ultimately how things will be done though, and with the input from his assistants, together they plan for success, but the manager always takes the plaudits. Thats just the way it is man.

It's the same for all clubs.

 

[SafHossain03]

I feel sad, I'm being ganged up on. I like how I'm a moron for the views I hold, yet pede isn't one for calling me a bin-dipper and a dole collector.

Not even sure what I said wrong. Just using a roundabout way to say that Chelsea have the best squad in the league, hands down. Liverpool minus Gerrard & Torres is a Portsmouth-level squad. We've managed fourth and CL semi on Rafa's tactics [the Drogba tactic failed epicly, but I still maintain the celebration was pathetic], and through Torres and Gerrard's goals. Ronaldo - and this is my view so please refrain from calling me a moron - has carried Manyoo this season with his 40 odd goals. Compare this to Chelsea, who have any number of players on their team who can come off the bench and create a moment of magic. So basically, without bein a moron this time, I could manage Chelsea.

 

[Help?]

I feel sad, I'm being ganged up on. I like how I'm a moron for the views I hold, yet pede isn't one for calling me a bin-dipper and a dole collector.

Not even sure what I said wrong. Just using a roundabout way to say that Chelsea have the best squad in the league, hands down . Liverpool minus Gerrard & Torres is a Portsmouth-level squad. We've managed fourth and CL semi on Rafa's tactics [the Drogba tactic failed epicly, but I still maintain the celebration was pathetic], and through Torres and Gerrard's goals. Ronaldo - and this is my view so please refrain from calling me a moron - has carried Manyoo this season with his 40 odd goals. Compare this to Chelsea, who have any number of players on their team who can come off the bench and create a moment of magic. So basically, without bein a moron this time, I could manage Chelsea.

Do you need any more reasons on why you are being ganged up on? Your views or not, this is a discussion forum and people here are discussing how little you understand of what's actually going on.

 

[dimo]

and I really try to give Grant credit, but find it hard

find it hard??? the guy has taken them to the cl final when everyone thought they werent going to get out of the group stage after the rosenborg result. he got them past liverpool and into the final which the special one wasnt able to do plus they will probably end up being tied on points for the league with manu.

grant deserves some credit, and i dont even like chelsea. i hope they win the cl though, just because i hate manu even more.

 

[Filipower]

Hehe, I never said he didn't have any credit, I just said I found it hard do give him. Look, I obviously have a fetish for trashing Grant, but in all seriousness I don't think he's that bad. Just don't put him on a pedestal either just because he did something that was inevitable sooner or later. Give him more time to prove himself.

 

[SafHossain03]

Do you need any more reasons on why you are being ganged up on? Your views or not, this is a discussion forum and people here are discussing how little you understand of what's actually going on.

I feel as though I have to defend myself, which I shouldnt have to do in a democratic society [saw how well that went, didn't we pede? ].

I'll admit I've not articulated my opinion in a way in which people might agree with me, but understand as a Liverpool fan I don't want to admit giving rivals credit [see: Drogba saying he doesn't dive]. It's just banter [see: pede calling me a bin-dipper, on the dole etc.; crosses over into insult category], as was my comment about the Portuguese: I'm English and they knocked us out thrice.

But for god's sake, dont be so pathetic as to call me clueless.

And why the hell do people keep bolding my quotes? You highlighted "Chelsea have the best squad in the league, hands down . Liverpool minus Gerrard & Torres are a Portsmouth-level squad." First of all, Liverpool are my own team and I can say whatever I like about them in the knowledge I'm more clued up than your good self.

Then I said that Chelsea have the best squad in the league. This is absolutely true. I also said earlier that it's till Mourinho's team - which it is. Grant's only major signing has been Anelka, who's started the majority of matches on the bench. My point is that Chelsea have a number of class players who can change the game. There, said it without any sense of idiocy. Maybe I shouldn't have boasted I could manage the team, but that was in reference to pede saying Avram is as competent a manager as anyone; with all due respect I can't say, how he's proved himself against the likes of Benitez, Ferguson or Mourinho. But considering he was brought in as a Director of Football, it's obviously not that hard to manage a squad like that. Either way saying I could manage was dumb.

"Ronaldo has carried Manyoo this season with his 40 odd goals." Sorry, but he has. Like Gerrard, Torres, and Benitez have carried Liverpool to what they've achieved. What am I even saying wrong here? Would Manyoo be top without Ronaldo's goals? Take a player like him out of the squad and they're brough down to about the level Arsenal are, in the sense that that squad be about third in the league.

Anything else? Ah yeah, Newbie, I owe you an apology. You're a big reds fan I'm sure, with your avatar and what not, so we should be best mates by now. But I find your lack of faith disturbing. Maybe you're a realist and I'm a pluralist, but I just didn't see any belief in the team or the manager in your posts is all.

I'm sure you're all going to find something to *discuss* about how clueless I am. Because that's exactly what you're doing, ganging up on me and claiming I know very little. Yeah, they are my views, and I should be allowed to express them without them being dismissed as me not knowing anything. That's all I'm gonna say. Maybe I'll stick to the kits thread. *Probably* wont be attacked there.

 

[pede54]

Saf mate listen. Just calm it down a bit thats all. We do not doubt that you love the reds, but you do not need to prove it all the time by hating on other clubs or other people. That is not really needed as we already appreciate that you love the 'pool. So do other reds fans on here, and they love as much as you do. Being a realist does not make a person a defeatist. Just as knowing all the facts about a club like an anorak, does not make anybody a better fan than the next guy.

As far as banter is concerned. Banter is fine, and it's also ok to react to it, but lets make this very clear, you called all Chelsea fans chavs. That is as inaccurate and silly as me calling all scousers bindippers. Now I am not a chav, and I doubt that you are actually a bin dipper or a dole cheat. Do you see how ridiculous it is that you took all of that name calling so personally? Thats banter.

It is said to get under your skin, which it did, but if you are going to dish it out, then you are going to get some back. The best thing would be if you perhaps were a little less free with the insults towards people, and simply discussed a subject matter instead.

I'm not trying to be condescending here but you strike me as being pretty young in years. Mind you, everyone on here is young in years compared to me, but what I'm trying to say is simply chill mate. The aggression in your writing is not warranted or indeed welcome. Be more tolerant mate, in life as well as in football matters. Football isn't doing for you what it is meant to do, if all you feel is anger and frustration.

Oh and don't assume that you are also the smartest dude on these forums. That does not go down too well either.

Keep posting though man because you have a right to post, and your opinions, like mine and everyone elses stimulate conversation. That's what a forum serves to do. It would be a shame if all we did was slag each other off all the time though wouldn't it.

 

[Help?]

I feel as though I have to defend myself, which I shouldnt have to do in a democratic society [saw how well that went, didn't we pede? ].

I'll admit I've not articulated my opinion in a way in which people might agree with me, but understand as a Liverpool fan I don't want to admit giving rivals credit [see: Drogba saying he doesn't dive]. It's just banter [see: pede calling me a bin-dipper, on the dole etc.; crosses over into insult category], as was my comment about the Portuguese: I'm English and they knocked us out thrice.

I'm sure you're all going to find something to *discuss* about how clueless I am. Because that's exactly what you're doing, ganging up on me and claiming I know very little. Yeah, they are my views, and I should be allowed to express them without them being dismissed as me not knowing anything. That's all I'm gonna say. Maybe I'll stick to the kits thread. *Probably* wont be attacked there.

That's your problem right there. What makes you think that just because you have genuine hatred for somebody, you can discard their achievements and have people agree with it. That's straight-up textbook bias. Biased opinions are uninformed, ignorant and incorrect. Hence they don't go down too well with members in here, and i'm sure in any other place. That's like saying George Bush is a great president and then get mad because majority of people refute that comment. You want us to agree with you, then take off your rose-coloured glasses and say how it really is, i'm sure you can do it.

Nobody tells you to **** off and go away somewhere, people want you to say what's true and unbiased, not biased opinions. Do you think, if i came out and said Messi is a young, immature player that ball hogs all the time and doesn't nothing for the team, nobody would gang up on me? I'd probably have the whole forum on my ass for weeks, because it would be an unsupported comment that lacks much truth. And if i was hating Barcelona (i don't but hypothetically speaking), that wouldn't be an excuse to make such a comment.



Now, just for you, i will tell you what was wrong with all those comments.
Manchester United is much more well-rounded than Chelsea this season and i'm pretty sure that absolutely everybody sees that. If they both played their starting 11s then they would be pretty even most likely (Chelsea winning in some areas and United in others), but looking at the subs bench, Chelsea's doesn't compare. As a Liverpool you hate United, but that doesn't mean that when something is true you should chose to ignore it.

If we take away Gerrard and Torres, then Liverpool will have Reina, Skrtel, Carragher, Aurelio, Arbeloa, Babel, Kuijt, Alonso, Mascherano, Benayon, Crouch. Liverpool fan or not, that's miles above James, Johnson, Campbell, Distin, Hreirdasson, Krancjar, Diarra, Bouba Diop, Mvuemba, Baros, Defoe. The Liverpool players have world class experience, whereas Porstmouth players are just your average EPL players.


Now the point about Ronaldo carrying United. Sure, he scored 30 goals for us in the league out of 78. That's not even half and how many of those did he help defend to conceed only 22 goals in 38 games (lower than any other team)? You have just discredited all the hard work that VDS, Vidic, Ferdinand, Evra and Brown have put in to be the best defense in the league for somebody that stuck around the half-way line the whole season? Ronaldo's contribution is phenomenal no doubt, but its a team game and had we had a shaky defense, all the 30 goals he scored wouldn't really mean that much. And what makes you think that just because Ronaldo scored 30 goals, if he wasn't playing, then nobody else would have scored them? Just like with your Torres and Gerrard example. Just because you put Ronaldo on the bench, doesn't mean that United would play with 10 men. Whoever would be instead of him, maybe wouldn't score as many, but there would be somebody else to make up for those goals, maybe more maybe less who knows. But from your opinion i understand that had Ronaldo not been playing this whole season, then United would only score 48 goals? There are other sources for goals you know.


As for you being a competent manager for Chelsea job, i take that that comment was actually aimed at saying that Grant barely did anything for Chelsea, right? If not, then pardon me. Otherwise, Mourinho had a better team last year in my opinion and he still couldn't manage to get into the CL. Sure it made it much easier for Grant to have all those players at his disposal, but manager's job is far from just being able to bring in good players. Infact that's a peripheral part of management i would say. Chelsea were in turmoil when Mourinho left and now look where they are. Ofcoarse its not all down to Grant himself, but don't discredit him either, after the season Chelsea has been through.

 

[pede54]

Phew. Stirring stuff mate. Good post.

hahahhaa..." ball hogs ". I haven't heard that for a long time.

 

[newbie original]

....Anything else? Ah yeah, Newbie, I owe you an apology. You're a big reds fan I'm sure, with your avatar and what not, so we should be best mates by now....

We have a difference of opinion.....that's all. I was not offended by anything you said. There are further discussions in the Liverpool thread about managerial decisions/outlook/predictions, etc. You sure as hell do NOT have to apologize.

But I find your lack of faith disturbing. Maybe you're a realist and I'm a pluralist, but I just didn't see any belief in the team or the manager in your posts is all.....

Frustration is the cause for that. Although there are times when I agree 100%!!! I think you caught me during a "frustrated" patch.

 

[newbie original]

Ticket to Moscow final = Russian Visa

 

[yoyo913]

the minor falls and major lifts

The baffled king composing Hallelujah

Hallelujah, Hallelujah
Hallelujah, Hallelujah