Stadium Packs Unification [Discussion]

[V.K]

Hi all!
And primarily @GIGGIRIVA @Harry BullZak @valambrosio2 @Skoczek @ovide
As you know stadium packs for FIFA 14 these days can take up to 35-40 GB. That means ~100 GB for anyone using CP, FIP, FNT, etc. at the same time. However, vast majority of those stadiums are the same, just with different IDs in different mods.

With Jenkey's File Loader we can potentially have just one folder "Stadiums" that can be shared between all major mods.

Now, I am aware that some old stadiums are needed for CP and some newer stadiums are needed for FIP, for example, and that no modder wants to rebuild their stadium pack to fit another mod's DB, but maybe we can at least start a discussion of some sort of unification/harmonization?

For example, I have separate stadium packs right now and I realized that I have at least 2 identical file sets for Seoul Stadium (ID 108 in CP, ID 22 in FIP).
Maybe one of those file sets could be one day renamed so that the files can be shared?
We have this IDs list assembled by @Re_coded https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ti7VtcZQHyNcuSWHN6VmqVHeQE3PoMTr/edit, maybe it can be helpful.
According to this list Seoul Stadium has appeared in FIFAs with IDs 23 and 108, while ID 22 has been assigned to Yokohama Stadium.
I am more than sure that official "EA ID" stadiums (WC 2022, Euro 2012, WC 2018, etc. ones) and the respective files can be shared without any conflicts

Secondly, stadium previews.
From what I have seen most preview packs have a mixture of ingame-screenshot generated images and real life photos.
The only complete preview pack I've seen is the one from CP by @GIGGIRIVA.
And personally I would probably advise everybody to consider using the same previews style to have uniformity and convenience.
I belive that ingame-screenshot generated previews are not informative enough, most stadiums have similar looking interiors and it's the facade pictures that make many of them iconic. Besides, just one picture can be used for all weathers/times of day, which also saves time.

Alternatively, if one desires, different images can be added for day/dusk/night previews:

Lastly, naming.
Here personally I prefer the FNT mod style by @Skoczek with country prefixes such as RUS - Lokomotiv Stadium.
With stadium counts nearing 500, it is often rather difficult to find the stadium you need, especially when you aren't sure about the current sponsor name.
For example, does it start with Estadio/Stadio/Stade/Stadium/Arena? Is it Gazprom Arena or Krestovsky Stadium or Stadion Sankt-Peterburg? What is the current name of Hamburg's stadium: Stadium Hamburg/HSH Nordbank Arena/Volksparkstadion/AOL Arena/Imtech Arena?
At least with prefixes like GER- or RUS- you know which letter you need to scroll to first. And then the real-life picture will help.
Of course, country prefixes might mean a couple of political cases where the the country of the stadium/city has changed but these shouldn't be too frequent.

Once again, this is not a request for immediate changes but rather a suggestion some food for thought.
Full harmonization might be impossible right away due to ID limits, but about ~75 GB might be saved for everyone's hard drives

 

[Gamer_KR1925]

Top Idea

 

[Skoczek]

Hi all!
And primarily @GIGGIRIVA @Harry BullZak @valambrosio2 @Skoczek @ovide
As you know stadium packs for FIFA 14 these days can take up to 35-40 GB. That means ~100 GB for anyone using CP, FIP, FNT, etc. at the same time. However, vast majority of those stadiums are the same, just with different IDs in different mods.

With Jenkey's File Loader we can potentially have just one folder "Stadiums" that can be shared between all major mods.

Now, I am aware that some old stadiums are needed for CP and some newer stadiums are needed for FIP, for example, and that no modder wants to rebuild their stadium pack to fit another mod's DB, but maybe we can at least start a discussion of some sort of unification/harmonization?

For example, I have separate stadium packs right now and I realized that I have at least 2 identical file sets for Seoul Stadium (ID 108 in CP, ID 22 in FIP).
Maybe one of those file sets could be one day renamed so that the files can be shared?
We have this IDs list assembled by @Re_coded https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ti7VtcZQHyNcuSWHN6VmqVHeQE3PoMTr/edit, maybe it can be helpful.
According to this list Seoul Stadium has appeared in FIFAs with IDs 23 and 108, while ID 22 has been assigned to Yokohama Stadium.
I am more than sure that official "EA ID" stadiums (WC 2022, Euro 2012, WC 2018, etc. ones) and the respective files can be shared without any conflicts

Secondly, stadium previews.
From what I have seen most preview packs have a mixture of ingame-screenshot generated images and real life photos.
The only complete preview pack I've seen is the one from CP by @GIGGIRIVA.
And personally I would probably advise everybody to consider using the same previews style to have uniformity and convenience.
I belive that ingame-screenshot generated previews are not informative enough, most stadiums have similar looking interiors and it's the facade pictures that make many of them iconic. Besides, just one picture can be used for all weathers/times of day, which also saves time.

Alternatively, if one desires, different images can be added for day/dusk/night previews:

Lastly, naming.
Here personally I prefer the FNT mod style by @Skoczek with country prefixes such as RUS - Lokomotiv Stadium.
With stadium counts nearing 500, it is often rather difficult to find the stadium you need, especially when you aren't sure about the current sponsor name.
For example, does it start with Estadio/Stadio/Stade/Stadium/Arena? Is it Gazprom Arena or Krestovsky Stadium or Stadion Sankt-Peterburg? What is the current name of Hamburg's stadium: Stadium Hamburg/HSH Nordbank Arena/Volksparkstadion/AOL Arena?
At least with prefixes like GER- or RUS- you know which letter you need to scroll to first. And then the real-life picture will help.
Of course, country prefixes might mean a couple of political cases where the the country of the stadium/city has changed but these shouldn't be too frequent.

Once again, this is not a request for immediate changes but rather a suggestion some food for thought.
Full harmonization might be impossible right away due to ID limits, but about ~75 GB might be saved for everyone's hard drives

About stadium previews, I was planning to ask you, because I want go fully on these previews as well. So as I see, it's already too late, I ask you here, do you have any sort of archive of these previews? Since I don't feel like repeating the same work with huge amount of pictures.

About IDs, I'm going to "as close as FIFA 14", so for example Red Bull Arena in Leipzig will have ID 139 instead of 420, because of possible left over name strings and even maybe commentary parts?

I'm staying with prefixes - nothing changed.

 

[V.K]

About stadium previews, I was planning to ask you, because I want go fully on these previews as well. So as I see, it's already too late, I ask you here, do you have any sort of archive of these previews? Since I don't feel like repeating the same work with huge amount of pictures.

I've only made previews for WC'22 stadiums.

About IDs, I'm going to "as close as FIFA 14", so for example Red Bull Arena in Leipzig will have ID 139 instead of 420, because of possible left over name strings and even maybe commentary parts?

Well Leipzig had both 139 and 420 IDs I guess, from WC'06 to F20, EA didn't keep the ID themselves, both are valid.
Although I highly doubt they have any unused stadium commentary.

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

I can not. I just can't change ID. I don't work on one database but on dozens of databases. Each stadium is set up for dozens of teams not two like most other patches. If I change ID at the Sant'Elia stadium it means changing the ID of the following teams.
Cagliari 70-71
Cagliari 71-72
Cagliari 72-73
Cagliari 73-74
Cagliari 74-75
Cagliari 75-76
Cagliari 76-77
Cagliari 77-78
Cagliari 78-79
Cagliari 79-80
Cagliari 80-81
Cagliari 81-82
Cagliari 82-83
Cagliari 83-84
Cagliari 84-85
Cagliari 85-86
Cagliari 86-87
Cagliari 87-88
Cagliari 88-89
Cagliari 89-90
Cagliari 90-91
Cagliari 91-92
Cagliari 92-93
Cagliari 93-94
Cagliari 94-95
Cagliari 95-96
Cagliari 96-97
Cagliari 97-98
Cagliari 98-99
Cagliari 99-00

Not counting the 5-year teams and the changes to be made manually on the DLCs in which a stadium appears.

Also consider that I have no interest in current stadiums and therefore the IDs that would be used for those stadiums mean for me having the possibility of having classic stadiums that are more useful for my project. For me it is useless to have the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium of 2019. I can use its ID to perhaps have the Stadio Olimpico in Rome before the changes of Italia 90. This stadium would have a use on the patch that is double compared to the list mentioned for the Sant'Elia only for Cagliari because they concern both Lazio and Rome from about 1950 to 1990. It's 40 years... about 80 teams not counting the Italian national team.

I can't force an ID list on anyone also because I'm sure one day I'll use all usable IDs. I don't space, as you know, on a single season (2022-23) where, for example, Sant'Elia is not needed (no longer in use since 2017) while Tottenham Hotspur Stadium is needed (active since 2019) but on about 150 years of history up to to 2010. But as a consequence not even the others can impose on me a list of IDs that I can use.

 

[Harry BullZak]

I'm with GIGGIRIVA on this. It's a lot more work than you think to try to get a stadium pack that will work for all mods. Especially when you are talking about a Classic mod vs a Current mod.

It isn't that it isn't possible, because it is, but both he and I would probably need to create it and neither of us wants to spend what would be a considerable length of time to do it.

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

I'm with GIGGIRIVA on this. It's a lot more work than you think to try to get a stadium pack that will work for all mods. Especially when you are talking about a Classic mod vs a Current mod.

It isn't that it isn't possible, because it is, but both he and I would probably need to create it and neither of us wants to spend what would be a considerable length of time to do it.

Exact. I think it's just impossible from a structural point of view. As I said, there are stadiums of the latest construction that are useless to me. While for your patch they are important. While obviously I have dozens of stadiums that are useless to you because they are no longer used or even exist. It would take a table of 1000-2000 IDs. But even there it would be impossible. Because it would mean, as you yourself said, a huge modification work which due to inattention or tiredness can also lead to errors, bugs, or... worse... to crashes in the patches.

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

Am I wrong or was this discussion already addressed via private messages years ago?

 

[Skoczek]

I'm with GIGGIRIVA on this. It's a lot more work than you think to try to get a stadium pack that will work for all mods. Especially when you are talking about a Classic mod vs a Current mod.

It isn't that it isn't possible, because it is, but both he and I would probably need to create it and neither of us wants to spend what would be a considerable length of time to do it.

The thing is every mod has its own purpose and aren't entirely interchangable. GIGGI don't need Atletico's Metropolitano, Harry don't need San Marino Stadium, I don't need old Wembley.
I assume that if possible we use official EA ids when possible, but when it isn't, everyone has their own filling.

Am I wrong or was this discussion already addressed via private messages years ago?

If there was any, I wasn't there.

 

[messi as]

The one with a base of updated stadiums and in HD is @locosbuda he also has new ID stadiums created by him, I would like that base but I doubt he wants to upload his entire stadium pack that adapts to Harry's mod.

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

If there was any, I wasn't there.

An old conversation from about 5 or even 7 years ago.

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

As for the previews, I'm glad you like the one I created. I'll post the templates I use.

1.37 MB file on MEGA

mega.nz

 

[locosbuda]

The one with a base of updated stadiums and in HD is @locosbuda he also has new ID stadiums created by him, I would like that base but I doubt he wants to upload his entire stadium pack that adapts to Harry's mod.

I wouldnt say its ID’s “created by me”, I just follow the ones on FIP cos that’s the mod almost everybody uses

 

[messi as]

I wouldnt say its ID’s “created by me”, I just follow the ones on FIP cos that’s the mod almost everybody uses

But there are new stadiums that you already assigned an ID that are not in the FIP mod.

 

[V.K]

huge modification work

considerable length of time

Of course I do understand that Old Wembley is not needed in patch 1 and Seoul Stadium is not needed in patch 2.
However, I was thinkimg maybe we can all try to lean towards official EA IDs where possible, or when you need to add a new stadium you'd look up the IDs used in other stadium packs and maybe use the same ID if it's free, or maybe now that Gonzaga is releasing World Cup 2022 stadiums we can all agree that we will use the official EA IDs for Lusail and Al Bayt (if you ever add them to your stadium packs).

I know it's not easy to manage, but maybe just an idea for our way forward, to avoid instances of "3 sets of Old Trafford files with different IDs, 100 Mb each).

For my personal use first I'll at least try and detect the "identical" IDs, and try to create a system with File Loader as follows:
folder "Stadiums - common": Emirates, Santiago Bernabeu, etc. shared between all mods (I expect ~20 GB of saved space);
folder "Stadiums - CP": Old Luzhniki, Highbury, Vicente Calderon, etc. to be used when CP is activated;
folder "Stadiums - FIP": Metropolitano Madrid, West Ham Olympic, etc. to be used when FIP is activated.

 

[Harry BullZak]

Am I wrong or was this discussion already addressed via private messages years ago?

Yeah, we did a few years ago.

Of course I do understand that Old Wembley is not needed in patch 1 and Seoul Stadium is not needed in patch 2.
However, I was thinkimg maybe we can all try to lean towards official EA IDs where possible, or when you need to add a new stadium you'd look up the IDs used in other stadium packs and maybe use the same ID if it's free, or maybe now that Gonzaga is releasing World Cup 2022 stadiums we can all agree that we will use the official EA IDs for Lusail and Al Bayt (if you ever add them to your stadium packs).

I know it's not easy to manage, but maybe just an idea for our way forward, to avoid instances of "3 sets of Old Trafford files with different IDs, 100 Mb each).

For my personal use first I'll at least try and detect the "identical" IDs, and try to create a system with File Loader as follows:
folder "Stadiums - common": Emirates, Santiago Bernabeu, etc. shared between all mods (I expect ~20 GB of saved space);
folder "Stadiums - CP": Old Luzhniki, Highbury, Vicente Calderon, etc. to be used when CP is activated;
folder "Stadiums - FIP": Metropolitano Madrid, West Ham Olympic, etc. to be used when FIP is activated.

I keep seeing using the official EA IDs, FIP does this as much as possible. The problem you are going to have is that CP doesn't, because it doesn't need to.

Now here is the thing. I have to recreate my stadium pack because of corruption issues so we have one opportunity to align a stadium pack for several mods.

Here is what I am not prepared to do.

• I am not going to align a stadium pack with CP. For the reasons, GIGGIRIVA and I have stated.
• I am not interested in the preview images at all, so somebody else will need to work on those being consistent.

Here is what I am willing to do.

• I will create a base Excel file for all stadiums using the original EA ID's.
• I have an expanded list already created based on the original game IDs.
• Old EA ID's will be replaced by new EA ID's.
• As multiple stadiums have 2-3 EA ID's I will choose the most suitable number for each stadium. I may use the same ID that is used in CP for example.
• I will keep all original F14 stadiums, so no swaps whether the stadium is used or not.
• I will replace F14 original stadiums with newer versions if they exist.
• I will create the entire pack.
• I will use Jenkey File Loader and create a folder structure that can be used for multiple mods.

I will do this under these circumstances.

• I will only accept input from @GIGGIRIVA @valambrosio2 @Skoczek @ovide @V.K and any other stadium makers.
• As I will be creating the pack I have the final say on what stadiums go under what ID etc.

 

[Skoczek]

I have such a problem that I have already finished my list of stadiums for FNT and I have almost all the stadiums I need.
What I am expected to? I can send a list of stadiums I'm going to have (as one Qatari stadium wasn't made yet).

 

[GIGGIRIVA]

I can't align with EA IDs either. As already mentioned yesterday I will most likely use all usable IDs. Not to mention that the IDs for new EA stadiums like Wanda, Tottenham Stadium, WC 2022 stadiums (I won't add WC 2022 or even EU2020 to the patch) and others are burnt IDs to me, blocked for nothing. Those IDs I'm sure I'll use in the future. So I just get out of it all. Good continuation

 

[Harry BullZak]

I have such a problem that I have already finished my list of stadiums for FNT and I have almost all the stadiums I need.
What I am expected to? I can send a list of stadiums I'm going to have (as one Qatari stadium wasn't made yet).

Send me your DB and Stadium ID list, please. I'll take a look and see what I can do.

I wouldnt say its ID’s “created by me”, I just follow the ones on FIP cos that’s the mod almost everybody uses

Send me your Staidum ID list, please.