Spain's Problem

[panxoman]

Iniesta is spanish 100% from Albacete, not catalan, but he was invited to play for Cataluña one of those stupid friendly matches.

jajajaja not stupids, VERY stupids XD

Of course anything different from what you think or want must be considered stupid.

You should also add, as it was said in some spanish press, that it was a reunion of terrorists.

 

[0le_Spain]

Of course anything different from what you think or want must be considered stupid.

You should also add, as it was said in some spanish press, that it was a reunion of terrorists.

Haven't been reading the Spanish press lately, where was that said?

 

[modena_10]

i don't know what spains problem is but for goodness sake please stop ******* up with all the insane talent you guys have.

 

[panxoman]

Haven't been reading the Spanish press lately, where was that said?

i.e: http://www.cope.es/ver_noticia.php?id_noticia=213480


Según Acebes, el público no acudió al Camp Nou "a un espectáculo deportivo, sino a un acto contra España y, encima, a favor de un terrorista"

This is said by the spokesman of the second most important spanish party.

 

[Crusad3r]

i.e: http://www.cope.es/ver_noticia.php?id_noticia=213480


Según Acebes, el público no acudió al Camp Nou "a un espectáculo deportivo, sino a un acto contra España y, encima, a favor de un terrorista"

This is said by the spokesman of the second most important spanish party.

And the sad thing is, he doesnt lie at all, there were lot of things supporting terrorism or terrorists in prison.

I dont think all the people there support terrorism, but you know some of them support terrorism.

 

[LDD]

And the sad thing is, he doesnt lie at all, there were lot of things supporting terrorism or terrorists in prison.

I dont think all the people there support terrorism, but you know some of them support terrorism.

Cut the crap

 

[panxoman]

And the sad thing is, he doesnt lie at all, there were lot of things supporting terrorism or terrorists in prison.

I dont think all the people there support terrorism, but you know some of them support terrorism.

10 people put a message in support of a terrorist and the whole act is in support of terrorism. Come on… I wasn’t in the stadium but it was just a football game with lots of families going there to watch sport and to demand some attention about something that they consider important: playing international competitions with what they feel their national team, not the team of the state where they are living in.

Did a few basques show up a message in support of a ETA terrorist? Yes. But, are there extremist in mostl football matches? Yes.

Comparing things is always unfair but what have you always said about racism is the famous Spain-England? There were more than 10 people doing the uh-uh-uh , so should we now say that friendly game was in support of racism and a trap for English black players? come on...

As always you’re mixing basque terrorrism, with basque nationalism which is something different, and with catalan nationalism which doesn’t have any relation with any them. You put it all in the same cocktail… but you forget spanish nationalism (which, and this is a personal opinion, I think is much more aggressive)

Finally, and this is directed personally to you Crusad3r. For all the times we’ve had discussion like this, I think you’re a spanish nationalist but not fascist. I do not share you’re opinions about some points, but I respect them and find them understandable. But are you starting to believe Acebes & friends? I though you know them, their lies and the reason why they do it..

 

[Crusad3r]

10 people put a message in support of a terrorist and the whole act is in support of terrorism. Come on… I wasn’t in the stadium but it was just a football game with lots of families going there to watch sport and to demand some attention about something that they consider important: playing international competitions with what they feel their national team, not the team of the state where they are living in.

Did a few basques show up a message in support of a ETA terrorist? Yes. But, are there extremist in mostl football matches? Yes.

Comparing things is always unfair but what have you always said about racism is the famous Spain-England? There were more than 10 people doing the uh-uh-uh , so should we now say that friendly game was in support of racism and a trap for English black players? come on...

As always you’re mixing basque terrorrism, with basque nationalism which is something different, and with catalan nationalism which doesn’t have any relation with any them. You put it all in the same cocktail… but you forget spanish nationalism (which, and this is a personal opinion, I think is much more aggressive)

Finally, and this is directed personally to you Crusad3r. For all the times we’ve had discussion like this, I think you’re a spanish nationalist but not fascist. I do not share you’re opinions about some points, but I respect them and find them understandable. But are you starting to believe Acebes & friends? I though you know them, their lies and the reason why they do it..

For you to be spanish = to be a fascist. Ignorant.

You should know i vote PSOE always.

But shame on you, you make a party, and you allow people burning spanish flags and supporting terrorism. Only 10 people? Its ok, but you allowed that guys to have fun in your party, so is the responsability of everyone there.

You dont wanna be spanish, you wanna be catalan, It's OK. But please, dont even try to defend that kind of acts cause its a big shame for everyone here.

 

[-William-]

For you to be spanish = to be a fascist. Ignorant.

You should know i vote PSOE always.

But shame on you, you make a party, and you allow people burning spanish flags and supporting terrorism. Only 10 people? Its ok, but you allowed that guys to have fun in your party, so is the responsability of everyone there.

You dont wanna be spanish, you wanna be catalan, It's OK. But please, dont even try to defend that kind of acts cause its a big shame for everyone here.

Finally, and this is directed personally to you Crusad3r. For all the times we’ve had discussion like this, I think you’re a spanish nationalist but not fascist.

I'm guessing you did not read that part...?

 

[Crusad3r]

Finally, and this is directed personally to you Crusad3r. For all the times we’ve had discussion like this, I think you’re a spanish nationalist but not fascist.

I'm guessing you did not read that part...?

I guess you are a nationalist if you dont support terrorism.

For some of you to be nationalist is somethink like: "hey, im spanish and i dont have any problem with that"

anyway guys, plz lets stop this, i like talking about football not talking about crap of politic things.

 

[0le_Spain]

i.e: http://www.cope.es/ver_noticia.php?id_noticia=213480


Según Acebes, el público no acudió al Camp Nou "a un espectáculo deportivo, sino a un acto contra España y, encima, a favor de un terrorista"

This is said by the spokesman of the second most important spanish party.

Oh ok i thought you meant that the Spanish press themselves were calling it a terrorist act.

It's clear that people on all sides have used that match for their political purpose. Catalan and Basque separatist or nationals use it to promote their ideals and agendas, Acebes used it to bash Zapatero, the ETA use it to support a terrorist,and so on...

That's what happens when you mix politics with football or any sport. While some people just want to see a good match other people have used it to promote hate.

While i don't agree with Crusader i do wonder what would happen if somebody( a Catalan for example) would show up at that match with a Spanish flag and saying 'Catalonia is Spain', which i'm sure there are tons of catalans that feel Spanish and support that idea. Would that be okay for them or would they have been attacked or verbally abused by opposing groups. Is that same tolerance for free speech on both sides?

 

[RazielSR]

The problem here is that if Barcelona gets the Champions league final, SPAIN WILL SUPPORT BARÇA, but if another team as Madrid or Valencia gets to the final, Cataluña won't support that SPANISH team.

 

[LDD]

The problem here is that if Barcelona gets the Champions league final, SPAIN WILL SUPPORT BARÇA, but if another team as Madrid or Valencia gets to the final, Cataluña won't support that SPANISH team.

whatever

 

[panxoman]

For you to be spanish = to be a fascist. Ignorant.

You should know i vote PSOE always.

But shame on you, you make a party, and you allow people burning spanish flags and supporting terrorism. Only 10 people? Its ok, but you allowed that guys to have fun in your party, so is the responsability of everyone there.

You dont wanna be spanish, you wanna be catalan, It's OK. But please, dont even try to defend that kind of acts cause its a big shame for everyone here.

To crusad3r:

supongo que se te habrá pasado el calentón. Ahora leete con calma otra vez lo que he escrito y verás que ni te llamo fascista ni defiendo nada de terrorismo.

A ver si pensamos un poquito antes de escribir chatín

 

[panxoman]

The problem here is that if Barcelona gets the Champions league final, SPAIN WILL SUPPORT BARÇA, but if another team as Madrid or Valencia gets to the final, Cataluña won't support that SPANISH team.

That's not true, amny people didn't support Barça in last year CL final, but I don't mind. I think that's normal. Rivalry exists.


And I promise you that all the catalan people who I knows doesn't have any special hate to Valencia. It's you who think that's there a huge rivalry but for us, you're another team as any other.

By the way, I don't have any problem if you win the CL (if Barça is not playing it of course)

 

[Crusad3r]

To crusad3r:

supongo que se te habrá pasado el calentón. Ahora leete con calma otra vez lo que he escrito y verás que ni te llamo fascista ni defiendo nada de terrorismo.

A ver si pensamos un poquito antes de escribir chatín

A ver si pensamos un poco antes de llamar nacionalistas a los demas, asi sin mas.

A ti posiblemente te interese mucho la politica y te interesa muchisimo lo que diga Acebes. A mi lo que diga Acebes me importa muy poco, porque ni siquiera lo he votado y la politica me interesa muy poco mas aun en estos casos que solo busca dividir a las personas en lugar de buscar un punto de unión. En Cataluña teneis la mala costumbre de magnificar todo lo "malo" o negativo que dicen sobre vosotros, pueden decir 500 cosas buenas, pero si dicen algo malo, es porque la critica viene de un nacionalista o un facha. No os parais a analizar si podeis sacar algo positivo de esa critica.

Acebes posiblemente no sea el mejor ejemplo de tolerancia, pero tampoco lo son ninguno de los portavoces de ERC, y de todos sus comentarios seguro que NUNCA te echas las manos a la cabeza.


Paso 2 meses al año en Manresa, cuna del catalanismo y se de lo que hablo. Teneis un ombliguismo exagerado, y te lo digo sin ningun tipo de rencor ni odio, mas bien desde el pasotismo, porque se que mis palabras no van a cambiar nada de nada en tu manera de pensar.

 

[panxoman]

While i don't agree with Crusader i do wonder what would happen if somebody( a Catalan for example) would show up at that match with a Spanish flag and saying 'Catalonia is Spain', which i'm sure there are tons of catalans that feel Spanish and support that idea. Would that be okay for them or would they have been attacked or verbally abused by opposing groups. Is that same tolerance for free speech on both sides?

To be honest I'm sure he would be verbally abused the same way that anyone weraing a catalan NT in Madrid for instance. That's the same on both sides.

The diffrence is that in Catalonia or basque country people living there can think whatever they want. The problem is when people from other areas of Spain is always telling us how you have to live, speak or feel at our home.We are never questioning how people have to live, speak, feel in madrid (i.e. Catalans would be happy in a Spain where our culture and feeling are respected, We don't want to impose it anywere but we want to keep it here . That's all.

I would support a spanish team representing this idea. I can not support a spanish football team cheered with spanish flags with bull in the center (which is a methaphor of the old Spain and it's values: bullfighting, centralism,...). As I said before , the basketball team looks a bit different .

 

[panxoman]

A ver si pensamos un poco antes de llamar nacionalistas a los demas, asi sin mas, porque no toleran el terrorismo ni nada relacionado con ello. Majete.

pero como quedamos, el problema es que te llame facista (que no lo he hecho) o que te llame nacionalista español? (que si he hecho)

A mi que te sientas muy español me da igual, lo encuentro normal y no te voy a criticar por ello.

El nacionalismo existe en todas partes, lo que pasa es que algunos como el catalán o el basco son defensivos para defender su cultura en su casa. (En absoluto te defiedo el terrosismo basco. Eso discutelo con un basco, no conmigo que no tengo nada que ver con eso, ni lo defiendo) y otros como el nacionalismo español tratan de imponer una idea uniforme de España basada en una cultura castellana ( que en el caso del fútbol es madrileña).

SORRY TO POST IN SPANISH. WE'LL KEEP WITH THIS IN PM IF NECESSARY

 

[Crusad3r]

To be honest I'm sure he would be verbally abused the same way that anyone weraing a catalan NT in Madrid for instance. That's the same on both sides.

The diffrence is that in Catalonia or basque country people living there can think whatever they want. The problem is when people from other areas of Spain is always telling us how you have to live, speak or feel at our home.We are never questioning how people have to live, speak, feel in madrid (i.e. Catalans would be happy in a Spain where our culture and feeling are respected, We don't want to impose it anywere but we want to keep it here . That's all.

I would support a spanish team representing this idea. I can not support a spanish football team cheered with spanish flags with bull in the center (which is a methaphor of the old Spain and it's values: bullfighting, centralism,...). As I said before , the basketball team looks a bit different .

The bull: maybe for you that is 1939 to 1975 and Bullfighting. But for other people that dont focus his life into politic things all the time, the bull just mean a symbol of the spain of our fathers, the bull is a symbol of spain, is not only about bullfighting cause most young people hate that but feel proud of that symbol. I dont know about you, but when i was a child i saw lot of big "bulls ads" in every spanish road, so for me is just a symbol of Spain cause that.

Centralism? Dont make me laugh. BTW, sorry to dissapoint you but actually Spain is one of the countries with less centralism in Europe. But in Cataluña people ignore that, cause they need a demon to fight every day.

Some spaniards have a bull in the flag = Every catalan car have a "burri" sticker in his back. What a stupid and big reaction, honestly, sometimes catalan looks they are waiting to jump over Spain. Freedom for Spain !! Dont you think you are being the intolerant now ?

Let us have the ******* bull, is not disrespect to Cataluña. Sick Brains.

 

[WilliamFAlmeida]

so....uh Im so lost in this discussion. Does this mean Cataloniains dont support the NT?
Why is it called basque "country" btw