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  • #31
    Originally posted by Gonira View Post
    2. manually adding a point to the first touch error slider of the away team, every game. it's the only setting i found in my slider set that i could use for this without making the game feel broken in away matches. unfortunately, the effect is much much softer than it should be for realistic home advantage, but at least it's something to make those two-legged cup ties start to make some sense.
    That's the best solution and a good start, because really nobody knows if half or even any of these codes work. But with sliders you see instant, definite results.

    But if you want to see a clear H vs A advantage/disadvantage, you do have to move sliders more than one tick. If default CPU First Touch Error is 65 (my current setting) then I would set it at 60 for CPU home games, and 70 for CPU away games. I would also do the same for CPU Shot Error and CPU Pass Error: lower/raise 5 points from whatever I've set as default. In fact, with CPU Pass Error, you have to move the slider as much as 10 points either way to see a real and definite difference in CPU pass accuracy.

    I've never understood why people spend weeks and months searching for working codes, when all it takes to get the required results is 15-20 seconds of slider adjustments before each game. And that applies to tactics and even overall difficulty as well. A couple of quick line slider adjustments and CPU teams will play more of an all-out attacking game, or will play much more cautiously and defensively. You could even use those sliders to adjust for H v A differences in CPU play.
    Last edited by bangus; 05-10-2016, 11:53:AM.

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    • #32
      Every touch by any player is absolutely perfect and what annoys me is that first touch is only triggered if receiving a pass and the sprint button is pressed with the analog stick in any direction.

      So if you simply receive a pass there is no error in trapping the ball which is stupid.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by bangus View Post
        That's the best solution and a good start, because really nobody knows if half or even any of these codes work. But with sliders you see instant, definite results.

        But if you want to see a clear H vs A advantage/disadvantage, you do have to move sliders more than one tick. If default CPU First Touch Error is 65 (my current setting) then I would set it at 60 for CPU home games, and 70 for CPU away games. I would also do the same for CPU Shot Error and CPU Pass Error: lower/raise 5 points from whatever I've set as default. In fact, with CPU Pass Error, you have to move the slider as much as 10 points either way to see a real and definite difference in CPU pass accuracy.

        I've never understood why people spend weeks and months searching for working codes, when all it takes to get the required results is 15-20 seconds of slider adjustments before each game. And that applies to tactics and even overall difficulty as well. A couple of quick line slider adjustments and CPU teams will play more of an all-out attacking game, or will play much more cautiously and defensively. You could even use those sliders to adjust for H v A differences in CPU play.
        i have a different experience with sliders in regards of even an one point change having noticeable impact in many cases. actually, i tried a 2-point difference in cpu pass error (one click up if they're away, one click down home and standard value if neutral) and for me the gap in difficulty was very big, perhaps even bigger than it should. and it created that problem of my away games having good quality and home games being boring. for me, picking some sliders that you can deviate for the cpu if home and for ourselves if away (or vice-versa) gives more consistent experience. i could use cpu pass error one click down away and my pass error one click down home, but sadly the change in cpu playing quality when moving pass error sliders up or down is bigger than the change in my own. that's a good slider to experiment though, has a great impact on difficulty, but 5 or 10 point changes sound really crazy to me. it's not that their pass accuracy % changes too much with fewer clicks, but the quality of their play increases greatly. they become faster, more audacious and more precise in their chance creation when pass error is lower.

        that being said, one-click difference in fte is indeed very subtle, but i tried 2 clicks and it already started to feel clunky and obvious. i didn't like the result of changing sprint speed too, felt too artificial. i know i won't get proper home advantage with too small of a change, but i'll only go further if it doesn't hurt gameplay and the change goes well both ways: same change in user and cpu sliders depending of who is playing home. i'll try shot error to see how it works. but i know i won't go further than just one click so i don't throw away the balance i have in my slider set right now. i remember how obvious the change on each step of shot error was when i was creating the set. not only in accuracy, but in shot power and quality. yeah, call me a conservative.

        ps: i totally agree with you that sliders right now are the best solution, but i'd still like to see a code that could (really) make key ratings of players be impacted accross the board by home/away advantage. if implemented right, it would definitely feel more organic.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by regularcat View Post
          first touch is only triggered if receiving a pass and the sprint button is pressed with the analog stick in any direction.
          i had no idea about this. are you sure? damn, you spoiled me now :P

          ime, a higher fte hurts chance creation, as you often need an extra moment to dominate the ball when receiving a crucial pass, sometimes enough to have the ball stolen.

          btw, according to my research about real life home advantage, it could take less than we think to achieve it. to match home adv. of big european leagues, all you need is that the home team creates on average ~30% more scoring chances. 1.3 to 1.0 doesn't sound like thaaat much.

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          • #35
            tried changing shot error. didn't like.
            if what's happening with the change is too clear to my eyes, it really distracts me. i might have an ocd or something.

            i'll go with: -1 fte for home team, +1 fte for away, 0/0 on neutral ground. i'll play a season, take note of the stats and report back in a few weeks.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Gonira View Post
              ps: i totally agree with you that sliders right now are the best solution, but i'd still like to see a code that could (really) make key ratings of players be impacted accross the board by home/away advantage. if implemented right, it would definitely feel more organic.
              Of course. But you work with what you have, and you have to realize this is FIFA. And FIFA is coded a certain way every year, and no ini codes are going to fix the many game play issues this series has. BUT... sliders can indeed at least HELP with many of those game play issues. So I get to work tinkering with the in-game tactics options and sliders, rather than do nothing and hope for someone to come up with some miracle ini codes.

              The one area PES > FIFA, is PES incorporates real and actual CPU tactical and formation changes. Whereas all that happens in FIFA, is the CPU is given a 100% boost in speed, agility and shooting when it needs to score. FIFA is a child's toy game in that regard. What people are trying to do with these ini codes is the equivalent of trying to turn a Yugo into a luxury auto. It'll never happen, because the game's coding framework can't and won't allow for it. Because no matter what HvA ini codes one comes up with, the cheap and cheesy CPU AI boost programming, whenever it kicks in, will always override those codes, nullifying any and all HvA advantages.

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              • #37
                @bangus - if these boosts you say were just added to whatever boosts or dips introduced by a h/a code istead of overriding them, it could work. the problem is making this right would require some development effort and i think ea just doesn't care, cos i can't see an effort like this bringing them much money (why wasting resources in career realism instead of marketing and fut fantasy football, right?)

                @regularcat - i just tested and i'm positive that first touch also influences short passes with no sprint. it's not that the player will miss the touch, but the quality of the touch is changed. more fte means less balance when receiving a pass and more time needed to recover balance.
                Last edited by Gonira; 05-10-2016, 04:02:PM.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Gonira View Post
                  @bangus - if these boosts you say were just added to whatever boosts or dips introduced by a h/a code istead of overriding them, it could work. the problem is this would require good development effort and i think ea just doesn't care, cos i can't see an effort like this bringing them much money (why wasting resources in career realism instead of marketing and fut fantasy football, right?)
                  I mention these things, not to complain really, but to show how some aspects of FIFA can never be properly fixed due to the extremely simplistic tactical coding. So what I do each year is tweak player ratings and sliders in such a way as to create as close to a simulation as possible, knowing that certain aspects - H v A advantage for example - will never be close to realistic. I live with it, and get on with enjoying and having fun with that which the game does right.

                  A note about Pass Error... I adjust my sliders to help with the game play, but also to emulate real-life stats. I just checked, and my CPU Pass Error slider is actually at 85. While this does cause a lot of wayward passes, the CPU always ends up with 79-82% pass completion, which is exactly what the team average is in the EPL. So for me it's not just about "what looks right," it's also and once again about what the game allows, based on the way it's coded.
                  Last edited by bangus; 05-10-2016, 04:37:PM.

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                  • #39
                    i get what you say and it's also the approach i like to use for setting sliders. but as long as emulating real life stats go, i focus more on goal attempts, which is the biggest indicator of how well a team is playing, so trying to get this stat right helps in realism as well as it does in difficulty. tinkering with shot error and half lenght i was able to get trueish-to-life s.o.g. stats with the set i use, then i just dialed gk ability to make this reflect in realistic scorelines and in the end it actually translated in very good gameplay.

                    but i use cpu pass error more as a difficulty dial, since the higher it goes, the less shots and goals cpu gets, compared to me, while their actual pass % has very little change, if any. my cpu pass error is still reasonably high anyway though, i have it on 65, and guess what: high 70's to low 80's accuracy, same as you.

                    huge disclaimer: i didn't want to tell before because it was irrelevant to the discussion (i guess?), but i'm still playing fifa 14 (my computer is meh), so perhaps 85 cpu pass error fells right on 16. on 14, it's definitely too high for me, the game gets too easy even on legendary with manual controls.
                    Last edited by Gonira; 05-10-2016, 11:10:PM.

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                    • #40
                      Hey gonira in this fifa17 dont work any string for me.
                      Change always slide is too boring.
                      I bought fifa17 but actualy i play with fifa16
                      For me is 1000000better fifa16(modding not clear)than fifa17
                      Cpu defense(with marking80)is ridicules,1shoot at game,1foul,possession possesion and nothingelse.
                      Only tactic finaly work,but with this cpu is losing time change all tactic for all teams.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by bjama View Post
                        Change always slide is too boring.
                        although not ideal, if it works and gameplay is ok, i can live with that.

                        Originally posted by bjama View Post
                        Cpu defense(with marking80)is ridicules,1shoot at game,1foul,possession possesion and nothingelse.
                        then why don't you keep marking closer to default?

                        Originally posted by bjama View Post
                        Only tactic finaly work,but with this cpu is losing time change all tactic for all teams.
                        tactics worked before (perhaps worse? i don't know) but i was never a fan of the changes the community usually made for them, they almost always introduced a tendency for the cpu to play excessive tiki-taka.
                        Last edited by Gonira; 05-10-2016, 11:08:PM.

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                        • #42
                          i made a big post to basically tell 1 tick+ for away first touch is the same as nothing, literally nothing, after analysing the stats of 30 games.

                          bangus was right afterall. have to change a lot of points and it doesn't hurt as i thought it would. i was scared to destroy balance, but screw balance! the goal is exactly to destroy it. away has to play worse, home has to play better, so simple.

                          i tried a friendly with same team against same team giving -7 pass error and +2 line height for me and +7error/-2height for cpu and it was just a tight match, finely contested, with equilibrated attempts on goal. which i won 1-0.

                          then i played the same thing with opposite sliders to simulate an away situation and it was just as fair, 0-0 until the 50th minute, even shots, cpu a bit better.

                          it seems pass error is the best slider for this. changes difficulty in a way that kinda mimics real life (home teams have statistic advantage in pass accuracy irl. shot accuracy and tackles are even).

                          the line height offset is a way to try to force offensive mentality. seems to help a bit.

                          just have to find the right numbers now. this is where low sample sucks. gonna play a spare champions league to have an idea. =D go united!
                          Last edited by Gonira; 11-10-2016, 05:34:AM.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Gonira View Post
                            i made a big post to basically tell 1 tick+ for away first touch is the same as nothing, literally nothing, after analysing the stats of 30 games. bangus was right afterall.
                            Thanks man, and now I get to wave this in one particular moaner's face, lol. You are absolutely right, something many don't try because it seems too extreme. You have to destroy the balance, in order to understand how to recreate the game to play the way you want it to play. Set the sliders all to 100, or set them all to 0. Not because you'll ever play the game that way, but to see the effect it has on the game, in order to understand how the sliders work and interact with other sliders. That's the only way to figure out what they do exactly. I now have this game playing better in many ways without editing tools, than I was able to achieve with FIFA 16 and rinaldo's tools. The core game has improved that much this year, even if it does have a few glitches and issues.

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                            • #44
                              Hey Gonira, I want to share something "crazy" because it seems you might understand this. My current speed/accel sliders: User 53, CPU 66. And I'm having some of the fairest, most balanced games I've ever had with a FIFA game.

                              First, I play with lower level teams. EA fabricates speed ratings as the way to give higher tier teams their 5 star ratings. 5 star players are typically rated in the 80+ speed range, whereas 2 star players are rated in the 60 speed range. It's pure BS that bears not resemblance to reality or logic, but that's what EA does.

                              To offset the speed rating cheat/disadvantage EA gives 2 star players, I have to raise User speed and accel sliders to 53. Then they run and move at what to me seems a normal and proper speed.

                              But the CPU speed game has always had its own disadvantage/coding glitch. I first noticed this in FIFA 14. In real life, players will grab the ball and burst up the pitch for long stretches. But in FIFA, the CPU only ever runs for a few steps - and never at full sprint - then slows down, or turns sideways, or passes the ball off. I wanted to fix this particular issue. And raising CPU speed and accel sliders 10-15 points higher goes a long way towards fixing it.

                              The coding and sliders in FIFA are all interdependent. Adjust one thing, and three other things are affected. Raising CPU speed and accel sliders seems to "signal" the CPU AI to take off and sprint. The game reads that CPU players are faster than User players, and can possibly outrun them, and so it now uses and incorporates that advantage into the way it moves the ball up the pitch. The CPU will actually take off and really sprint with the ball. But not all the time, and that's the best part. It just adds another very real element and dimension to the CPU attack game.

                              I play on lower difficulty and this hasn't throw the balance off in favor of the CPU. Not at all, the opposite has happened in fact. It has helped resolve a couple of legacy issues with the CPU game: not enough CPU attacking, and poor CPU defending. The CPU now has a dangerous speed element to its game that it uses from time to time. And it's something I have to be aware of tactically: making sure I'm not always using attack tactics otherwise the CPU can and will get in behind me. Also and because everything is interconnected, increasing CPU speed helps fix the CPU defending issue, as CPU defenders are now much quicker to react and get into proper position.
                              Last edited by bangus; 11-10-2016, 11:13:AM.

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                              • #45
                                that is some extreme experiment, which i never done, because, for sake of balance, i never seriously tried staggered sprint or accel sliders. i just try to make everything work fine for 3.5/4 star teams and then accept whatever handicap the game gives so the others are better or worse. but i always adjusted my sliders to legendary, so the cpu naturally plays aggressive against me.

                                you're right, just every football game ever made has big difference in speed between star players and normal players. it's not realistic, i just think it's a limitation of these games, the way they work doesn't seem to be able to replicate the quality gap of teams without messing with the speed of their players.

                                yeah, there's always side effects, sometimes they help, a lot of times it's just a pain that makes getting a proper slider set much harder. examples i've noticed: lower shot error or higher shot speed, cpu tries more long shots; higher pass error, cpu crosses go to the stands with a very high frequency; higher high line, cpu tries more lobbed passes; lower line width, having a cross becomes too easy; lower line lenght and width, it becomes harder to create chances through the middle; lower marking, it becomes easier to score from corners; lower sprint speed, you lose some animations - if too low, some players start jogging instead of running; if sprint+acceleration is much lower than it should, defense falls apart, attacking becomes too easy...

                                talking about side effects, be cautious with the acceleration slider, as it is directly linked to fatigue. if too low, players never get tired. if too high, players get tired too fast.

                                But the CPU speed game has always had its own disadvantage/coding glitch. I first noticed this in FIFA 14. In real life, players will grab the ball and burst up the pitch for long stretches. But in FIFA, the CPU only ever runs for a few steps - and never at full sprint - then slows down, or turns sideways, or passes the ball off. I wanted to fix this particular issue. And raising CPU speed and accel sliders 10-15 points higher goes a long way towards fixing it.
                                yeah, i notice this cpu behaviour too. good job if you found a way to fix it. your change makes sense. whenever i give a boost to some cpu slider, they actually seem to try to take advantage of that. i just don't think i'll try to implement this for me because, nitpicking perfectionist as i am, i'm sure this would put me in an one or two month slider adjusting quest to adapt everything else for such a change, and tbh this is one of the reasons i still stick to fifa 14 today. it's hard work.
                                Last edited by Gonira; 11-10-2016, 05:40:PM.

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